~ Depressed and scared, not making it financially ~

Posted by .harp player @amberpep, Feb 26, 2019

I’m 74 years old and moved 3 years ago from MD to VA. My girls had hounded me to come down for several years so I finally did it. I sold my condo (at a loss), and a job with a dentist. Well, here I am, and financially I’m just not making it. That amount I earned from the dentist covered me with just a little left over. Now, more than often, I don’t have enough. I eeked out just enough for my rent this month, and now there’s not even enough for a quart of milk. I get S.S. and what I get goes right out for my rent (usually there’s enough), and my son sends me money each month. I’m sickened, depressed, and scared. I live in low income housing, and have a budget that practically squeaks. I’m thinking of starting to sell some of my furniture.
I so wish I’d have stayed in MD, for so many reasons, this being one of them. I have applied for oodles of jobs (they’re all on line now), and legally they’re not supposed to ask you how old you are (although many do), but they all ask when you graduated from either high school or college …. well, it doesn’t take rocket science to figure out how old a person is. I’m so depressed about this, and .so upset that my stomach.constantly churns.
Thanks for letting me vent.
abby

If I knew I had been in direct contact with an infected person, I would have panic attacks, would not be able to sleep, would probably have the thermometer in my mouth every hour. My daughter's boyfriend painted a bedroom for me and while painting, he noticed a huge spider in a web next to the window. He has a phobia about spiders. So, instead of doing something about it, he just kept looking at it the whole time he was painting. He told my daughter that night he dreamed of a huge spider driving a car up the street. I laughed and never did forget it–that's been probably 20 years ago. To him, this was a real nightmare. I saw a centipede heading for my bedroom this winter. I got out the Rainbow Sweeper and tried to find it with it. My bedroom got cleaner but the centipede is still roaming around. I lay in bed at night, thinking is it in this bed? Of course, the blankets and sheets have been washed many times but I obsess over these things. I am still hibernating myself. I did finally after months, go to Wal Mart. I have always worn a scarf around my neck and if I heard anyone coughing or sneezing, I put it over my face. Now, I have a mask.

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@woogie good for you in wearing a mask It is so scary and is spread first the way other virus are spread ,via mouth ,cough sneeze and cold . I think those that refuse to wear a mask they are rebels that have'nt left there teenage years.

Liked by fiesty76

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@woogie, Your stories brought a smile and also a long forgotten memory. At summer camp away from home and homesick those first days, I awoke one morning to find a large grasshopper on my pillow! I was scared to pieces. Everyone in the cabin was suddenly awake because of my shrieks. A farm girl thought it hilarious and caught the monster and tossed him outside. I love small creatures but to this day do not like to see grasshoppers hopping around in my yard. I'm not yet shopping in stores but do wear a scarf when outside or on walks. I have a few hospital masks from an earlier purchase but am saving those for when I do venture into a shop at some point. After so long at home, did it feel really strange to be inside a store among others close by?

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@lioness

@fiesty76 Hi friend you made me laugh I think pea green and mustard yellow would be appropriate . I'm glad to hear we are't that old that a youngster can't spell either . Yes I'm taking my temp 2 times a day its 96.6 it was always low from the norm. Extra use of clorax,water on my soles of shoes , wash face and eyeglasses when I get back in . Besides the mask ,gloves and clothes . I did'nt do a painting but tried my hand a drawing I don't know if you call it zentangle as Ginger does but I'll post it see what you think . Glad your o.k. take care stay safe . Linda

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@lioness, Really glad to hear you are taking extra measures to stay safe! Did you post your zentangle in the visual thread? I'm behind on posts.

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@fiesty76

@lioness, Really glad to hear you are taking extra measures to stay safe! Did you post your zentangle in the visual thread? I'm behind on posts.

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@fiesty76 yes but it is more just doodling . @gingerw is the expert . Love her picture for her name

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@amberpep Just wondering how you’ve been doing. And how is your friend in Maryland? Have you been able to see her at all or communicate? Hope you’re ok

Liked by fiesty76

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@amberpep

I want my posts to be from newest to oldest, but don't know how so I'm just starting a new one. I hope it's OK.
I've lived in Staunton, VA for 4 years now, after moving from Frederick, MD where I lived with my husband, and 3 children for 30 years. I got divorced about 12-15 years ago (not sure of the date), but what I didn't know was that not only did my 2 daughters live down here, but so did my X-husband. I did not ask for alimony as at the time I had my Dad's inheritance, which was "ponzi-d" …. I won't go into that now. I live in a low-income apartment which I only leave to go to the grocery store. I see one of my daughter's about once a week. I worked for a dentist in Frederick and when he retired, I moved down here. At 75 I cannot find a job ….. anywhere down here. I struggle every month to pay my bills. If it weren't for my son who sends me money each month, I'd be on the streets. I struggle with Bipolar 2. The passed few weeks have been awful. Usually summer is my favorite time of year, but this year I feel like I'm in a deep dark hole, covered with a black wet blanket …. I'm calling out for help and people just stop, look in, and move on. I've tried to tell my girls how badly this has gotten, and also that part of it could be genetic (my mother was Bipolar 1), and they don't want to hear it. They sort of just change the subject, move on, or just walk away. I can't tell you how awful I feel ….. if I weren't so afraid, I'd probably end it all. No job, no friends (low income = unsafe), no church at this point even though I've been looking. I'm afraid to tell the new Psychiatrist I have down here as I'm afraid he'll put me in the hospital and the one down here isn't very safe either. I'm just at the end of my rope, afraid to die, yet afraid to live anymore.
Thanks for listening, abby

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@amberpep I recall reading your posts in several different discussions. What resources have you checked out that are available to you in your area, your county? Is there a senior services agency that help you, or have you considered taking a room in a private residence, where your living expenses would be less? What about moving back to the area you left, since you seem to be so unhappy where you are now? Or moving in with one of your children?
Ginger

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@gingerw

@amberpep I recall reading your posts in several different discussions. What resources have you checked out that are available to you in your area, your county? Is there a senior services agency that help you, or have you considered taking a room in a private residence, where your living expenses would be less? What about moving back to the area you left, since you seem to be so unhappy where you are now? Or moving in with one of your children?
Ginger

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Hi Ginger … I guess I do keep harping on the same thing over and over …. I'm sorry. I can't move back to where I was as without a job I could never afford it, even with my son's help. Believe me, if I could, I would. I went to the Senior Center twice now and it was awful … just a group of my age folks gossiping while they quilted, read their book, or knitted. Talk about depressing! I know more about their surgeries and medications than I ever needed to know. There's only 1 child I would want to live with and, in a joking way I mentioned it about a month or so ago. Her response? "Oh my no." I can't imagine living in someone else's house. I know my girlfriend up in MD has a woman from her church renting a room from her and it works well. But they knew each other for years. Again, I'm sorry to keep harping on this ….. I know it gets tiresome for you all.
abby

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I want my posts to be from newest to oldest, but don't know how so I'm just starting a new one. I hope it's OK.
I've lived in Staunton, VA for 4 years now, after moving from Frederick, MD where I lived with my husband, and 3 children for 30 years. I got divorced about 12-15 years ago (not sure of the date), but what I didn't know was that not only did my 2 daughters live down here, but so did my X-husband. I did not ask for alimony as at the time I had my Dad's inheritance, which was "ponzi-d" …. I won't go into that now. I live in a low-income apartment which I only leave to go to the grocery store. I see one of my daughter's about once a week. I worked for a dentist in Frederick and when he retired, I moved down here. At 75 I cannot find a job ….. anywhere down here. I struggle every month to pay my bills. If it weren't for my son who sends me money each month, I'd be on the streets. I struggle with Bipolar 2. The passed few weeks have been awful. Usually summer is my favorite time of year, but this year I feel like I'm in a deep dark hole, covered with a black wet blanket …. I'm calling out for help and people just stop, look in, and move on. I've tried to tell my girls how badly this has gotten, and also that part of it could be genetic (my mother was Bipolar 1), and they don't want to hear it. They sort of just change the subject, move on, or just walk away. I can't tell you how awful I feel ….. if I weren't so afraid, I'd probably end it all. No job, no friends (low income = unsafe), no church at this point even though I've been looking. I'm afraid to tell the new Psychiatrist I have down here as I'm afraid he'll put me in the hospital and the one down here isn't very safe either. I'm just at the end of my rope, afraid to die, yet afraid to live anymore.
Thanks for listening, abby

REPLY
@amberpep

I want my posts to be from newest to oldest, but don't know how so I'm just starting a new one. I hope it's OK.
I've lived in Staunton, VA for 4 years now, after moving from Frederick, MD where I lived with my husband, and 3 children for 30 years. I got divorced about 12-15 years ago (not sure of the date), but what I didn't know was that not only did my 2 daughters live down here, but so did my X-husband. I did not ask for alimony as at the time I had my Dad's inheritance, which was "ponzi-d" …. I won't go into that now. I live in a low-income apartment which I only leave to go to the grocery store. I see one of my daughter's about once a week. I worked for a dentist in Frederick and when he retired, I moved down here. At 75 I cannot find a job ….. anywhere down here. I struggle every month to pay my bills. If it weren't for my son who sends me money each month, I'd be on the streets. I struggle with Bipolar 2. The passed few weeks have been awful. Usually summer is my favorite time of year, but this year I feel like I'm in a deep dark hole, covered with a black wet blanket …. I'm calling out for help and people just stop, look in, and move on. I've tried to tell my girls how badly this has gotten, and also that part of it could be genetic (my mother was Bipolar 1), and they don't want to hear it. They sort of just change the subject, move on, or just walk away. I can't tell you how awful I feel ….. if I weren't so afraid, I'd probably end it all. No job, no friends (low income = unsafe), no church at this point even though I've been looking. I'm afraid to tell the new Psychiatrist I have down here as I'm afraid he'll put me in the hospital and the one down here isn't very safe either. I'm just at the end of my rope, afraid to die, yet afraid to live anymore.
Thanks for listening, abby

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Hi @amberpep, I moved your message to your previous discussion where you are connected with several members who know your story.

First some housekeeping.
1) to see all of your messages from newest to oldest, simply go to your profile and scroll down to your post. See here: https://connect.mayoclinic.org/member/39725aa00ced969899847a73bad8bf432266449e0/
2) to see the messages in a discussion from Newest to Oldest, select Newest to Oldest in the dropdown menu under the first message. See the example in the picture below. You can also read more here: https://connect.mayoclinic.org/discussion/new-customize-the-order-you-view-posts-see-new-posts-first/

About you
Abby, I'm sorry that you are feeling in a deep dark hole covered with a wet blanket. I really feel like you need to tell someone and encourage you to be honest with your psychiatrist. You mention that you are afraid to do so because he may send you to the hospital where you don't feel safe. We are here to support you Abby, but it sounds like you need trained counsellors to help you at this time. You might consider calling the NAMI Helpline. The NAMI HelpLine can be reached Monday through Friday, 10 am–6 pm, ET.
1-800-950-NAMI (6264) or info@nami.org
Learn more here: https://www.nami.org/help

If you feel in crisis at any time call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline to speak with a trained crisis counselor 24/7. They can help. Don't hesitate to call:
1-800-273-TALK (8255)

newest to oldest

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@amberpep

I want my posts to be from newest to oldest, but don't know how so I'm just starting a new one. I hope it's OK.
I've lived in Staunton, VA for 4 years now, after moving from Frederick, MD where I lived with my husband, and 3 children for 30 years. I got divorced about 12-15 years ago (not sure of the date), but what I didn't know was that not only did my 2 daughters live down here, but so did my X-husband. I did not ask for alimony as at the time I had my Dad's inheritance, which was "ponzi-d" …. I won't go into that now. I live in a low-income apartment which I only leave to go to the grocery store. I see one of my daughter's about once a week. I worked for a dentist in Frederick and when he retired, I moved down here. At 75 I cannot find a job ….. anywhere down here. I struggle every month to pay my bills. If it weren't for my son who sends me money each month, I'd be on the streets. I struggle with Bipolar 2. The passed few weeks have been awful. Usually summer is my favorite time of year, but this year I feel like I'm in a deep dark hole, covered with a black wet blanket …. I'm calling out for help and people just stop, look in, and move on. I've tried to tell my girls how badly this has gotten, and also that part of it could be genetic (my mother was Bipolar 1), and they don't want to hear it. They sort of just change the subject, move on, or just walk away. I can't tell you how awful I feel ….. if I weren't so afraid, I'd probably end it all. No job, no friends (low income = unsafe), no church at this point even though I've been looking. I'm afraid to tell the new Psychiatrist I have down here as I'm afraid he'll put me in the hospital and the one down here isn't very safe either. I'm just at the end of my rope, afraid to die, yet afraid to live anymore.
Thanks for listening, abby

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@amberpep

Hi, Abby. Do you play a harp? It's a beautiful instrument. I'm a pianist, kind of like a harp on legs with keys. My therapist has been trying to get me back to practicing, and I know it would be good for me, but there always seems to be a reason not to.

I was in a deep,dark hole right next to yours. I'd think I'd hit bottom, only to discover a deeper depth. I had no one to talk to at the time, until I admitted myself to a nice place that's an extension of our hospital, for people like me who had failed suicide attempts. I had been falling downward for a couple of years, and it took maybe 5 years to get out of the hole and away from the edge. I've tried to OD a few more times after I left the safe house.

We sometimes need more help than we can admit to. Even though we know better, a stigma remains, whether it's depression or bipolar or suicidal ideation or any other brain pain. And it really is pain that we feel. And some kinds of pain are more easily treated. As for our kids, my daughter gets it, partly because she has episodes of depression. Our son is a different story. He thinks I just need to pray more, etc. etc. When we visit, they pretend everything is ok. Maybe they think everything IS ok.

I never had the blanket over me. Does that make it feel heavier to be where you are? I'm not sure how I'd feel. Probably smothered.

I don't think we have any guarantee that everything will get better. What I'm still learning is how to move forward with the weight of the rocks in my backpack, and which rocks I can get rid of. It's looking like it will be a lifetime process for me.

Can you get an appointment with the local psychiatrist in their office, or are they only doing video conferencing? I Zoom with my therapist, and I don't get down to business with him like I do in his office. It's hard for me to express what's going on over the phone. I'm sure lots of people are ok with that but it's not a good way for me.

As Colleen said, you aren't alone in this. I know too well the aloneness, regardless of what people say. I would love to have the supernatural words to say that would lighten your load today. Before I go to sleep (already way past time), I'll pray for protection and comfort for you.

You're loved, Abby.

Jim

REPLY
@jimhd

@amberpep

Hi, Abby. Do you play a harp? It's a beautiful instrument. I'm a pianist, kind of like a harp on legs with keys. My therapist has been trying to get me back to practicing, and I know it would be good for me, but there always seems to be a reason not to.

I was in a deep,dark hole right next to yours. I'd think I'd hit bottom, only to discover a deeper depth. I had no one to talk to at the time, until I admitted myself to a nice place that's an extension of our hospital, for people like me who had failed suicide attempts. I had been falling downward for a couple of years, and it took maybe 5 years to get out of the hole and away from the edge. I've tried to OD a few more times after I left the safe house.

We sometimes need more help than we can admit to. Even though we know better, a stigma remains, whether it's depression or bipolar or suicidal ideation or any other brain pain. And it really is pain that we feel. And some kinds of pain are more easily treated. As for our kids, my daughter gets it, partly because she has episodes of depression. Our son is a different story. He thinks I just need to pray more, etc. etc. When we visit, they pretend everything is ok. Maybe they think everything IS ok.

I never had the blanket over me. Does that make it feel heavier to be where you are? I'm not sure how I'd feel. Probably smothered.

I don't think we have any guarantee that everything will get better. What I'm still learning is how to move forward with the weight of the rocks in my backpack, and which rocks I can get rid of. It's looking like it will be a lifetime process for me.

Can you get an appointment with the local psychiatrist in their office, or are they only doing video conferencing? I Zoom with my therapist, and I don't get down to business with him like I do in his office. It's hard for me to express what's going on over the phone. I'm sure lots of people are ok with that but it's not a good way for me.

As Colleen said, you aren't alone in this. I know too well the aloneness, regardless of what people say. I would love to have the supernatural words to say that would lighten your load today. Before I go to sleep (already way past time), I'll pray for protection and comfort for you.

You're loved, Abby.

Jim

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OMG Jim, you hit the nail on the head. I loved where I lived before in MD (30 years) and everything was there … close friends, doctors, church, my own condo, a job with a dentist, and I knew the town like the back of my hand. Due to some "ponzi" scheme on the part of a unscrupulous "wealth manager" I lost 90% of my father's inheritance to me. Now I essentially live on S.S. and by the generosity of my son he sends me some money each month. I've been trying to find a job since I moved here (4 years ago) but at 75 …. well, you can imagine. I do feel totally alone. Since I have not been able to connect with a church at this point, that doesn't help. I live in a low-income apartment complex which is totally unsafe (my SIL wants me to get a gun – absolutely NOT), so he got me a "bear pepper spray" and a "tazer". I never go out after dark. The Psychiatrist I use down here is very nice, but very busy …. each person only gets about 10 min. with him, just for a med. check. I did go to the hospital 1 time when I was in MD and went to a group for 4 weeks which was wonderful. We were all limping along emotionally and just getting to know there were others like you was a great help. My 2 adult girls convinced me to move down here because it was "so wonderful." Well, to them I'm sure it is but they've been here for years. The "wet blanket" part is merely an analogy …. in a dark wet hole, with a black, wet, blanket over me, calling out and no one will listen. That is how it feels. Somedays I feel like just walking away from all this, with my dog, and never to be seen again. But, financially, that's not a possibility. So I spend 90% of my time in my apartment. Some days I don't answer the phone or the door. I have not gotten dressed yet today and I doubt I will ….. I'll just stay in my bathrobe, watch mindless TV, and sleep. Oh and take the dog out. I have truly thought about ending it all, and there is the perfect way down here that no one would find me for days. Between Charlottesville and Staunton there is route 64, which runs along the spine of mountains, connecting the Appalachians and the Blue Ridge. If I drove over that at night (which I never do), took my seatbelt off, and really gunned the engine, I could go right over the edge and no one would know for days. But, I don't think I have the nerve to really do it. Afraid to live and afraid to die. My 2 daughters down here really don't want to hear anything at all …. they want everything to be peaches and cream, so I put on a good face. My therapist in MD called it "good Suzy". As soon as I try to tell them anything at all, no matter how small, they just say "yea" and walk away. That doesn't help. My son is in Northern Virginia and I don't see him very often, but bless him, he does send me money each month or I wouldn't make it.
Thank so so very much for sharing your story …. it helps so much to know exactly what it feels like. So often you feel so alone that you're sure you're the only one, and you're nuts!
Bless you Jim, and thank you, thank you, Please keep in touch.
Abby (yes, I have a Celtic Harp – I'm Scotch)

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@amberpep

OMG Jim, you hit the nail on the head. I loved where I lived before in MD (30 years) and everything was there … close friends, doctors, church, my own condo, a job with a dentist, and I knew the town like the back of my hand. Due to some "ponzi" scheme on the part of a unscrupulous "wealth manager" I lost 90% of my father's inheritance to me. Now I essentially live on S.S. and by the generosity of my son he sends me some money each month. I've been trying to find a job since I moved here (4 years ago) but at 75 …. well, you can imagine. I do feel totally alone. Since I have not been able to connect with a church at this point, that doesn't help. I live in a low-income apartment complex which is totally unsafe (my SIL wants me to get a gun – absolutely NOT), so he got me a "bear pepper spray" and a "tazer". I never go out after dark. The Psychiatrist I use down here is very nice, but very busy …. each person only gets about 10 min. with him, just for a med. check. I did go to the hospital 1 time when I was in MD and went to a group for 4 weeks which was wonderful. We were all limping along emotionally and just getting to know there were others like you was a great help. My 2 adult girls convinced me to move down here because it was "so wonderful." Well, to them I'm sure it is but they've been here for years. The "wet blanket" part is merely an analogy …. in a dark wet hole, with a black, wet, blanket over me, calling out and no one will listen. That is how it feels. Somedays I feel like just walking away from all this, with my dog, and never to be seen again. But, financially, that's not a possibility. So I spend 90% of my time in my apartment. Some days I don't answer the phone or the door. I have not gotten dressed yet today and I doubt I will ….. I'll just stay in my bathrobe, watch mindless TV, and sleep. Oh and take the dog out. I have truly thought about ending it all, and there is the perfect way down here that no one would find me for days. Between Charlottesville and Staunton there is route 64, which runs along the spine of mountains, connecting the Appalachians and the Blue Ridge. If I drove over that at night (which I never do), took my seatbelt off, and really gunned the engine, I could go right over the edge and no one would know for days. But, I don't think I have the nerve to really do it. Afraid to live and afraid to die. My 2 daughters down here really don't want to hear anything at all …. they want everything to be peaches and cream, so I put on a good face. My therapist in MD called it "good Suzy". As soon as I try to tell them anything at all, no matter how small, they just say "yea" and walk away. That doesn't help. My son is in Northern Virginia and I don't see him very often, but bless him, he does send me money each month or I wouldn't make it.
Thank so so very much for sharing your story …. it helps so much to know exactly what it feels like. So often you feel so alone that you're sure you're the only one, and you're nuts!
Bless you Jim, and thank you, thank you, Please keep in touch.
Abby (yes, I have a Celtic Harp – I'm Scotch)

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@amberpep Good to hear from you, Abby.

I spent much of my day assembling a rock puzzle. I started making a path from the main deck stairs several years ago, but in typical fashion for me, I've been procrastinating finishing the job. My wife would be the first to say that I often don't complete things. I suppose it's a sign of my depression.

I've gathered rocks from several places, focusing on ones that have a flat surface. Mostly, they've been free. Going to Lowe's and buying a pallet of rock pavers would have made the job a lot easier, but you know why that's not an option. I have only 6 feet to go, and then I can clear away the meds. Some of the rocks are 2" thick, while lots of them require some digging up to a foot deep. I always wear gloves for outside work, but they still are hurting, and my feet are at 8 or 9.

I didn't get to sit down and look through my inbox until a half hour ago, and I still need to take a shower before contaminating the sheets with the dirt that acquired. And since it's almost 11, I have to turn off my phone. Maybe tomorrow won't be such a long, hard day.

Jim

REPLY
@jimhd

@amberpep Good to hear from you, Abby.

I spent much of my day assembling a rock puzzle. I started making a path from the main deck stairs several years ago, but in typical fashion for me, I've been procrastinating finishing the job. My wife would be the first to say that I often don't complete things. I suppose it's a sign of my depression.

I've gathered rocks from several places, focusing on ones that have a flat surface. Mostly, they've been free. Going to Lowe's and buying a pallet of rock pavers would have made the job a lot easier, but you know why that's not an option. I have only 6 feet to go, and then I can clear away the meds. Some of the rocks are 2" thick, while lots of them require some digging up to a foot deep. I always wear gloves for outside work, but they still are hurting, and my feet are at 8 or 9.

I didn't get to sit down and look through my inbox until a half hour ago, and I still need to take a shower before contaminating the sheets with the dirt that acquired. And since it's almost 11, I have to turn off my phone. Maybe tomorrow won't be such a long, hard day.

Jim

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@jimhd, I'm laughing because like you, I am a better starter than finisher for some projects. Amazing how I can just "not see" paperwork waiting action, dust bunnies growing sometimes by leaps and bounds! I don't blame mine on depression however. Told my daughter several years ago that I seemed to be becoming flakier because I was stopping before finishing some projects. Out of the mouth of this beauty came: "Mom, you've Always been a bit flaky." Did she Really have to share that truth??? I'm the only mom she has!!! smiles

Understand your soreness and hurting from the heavy duty digging, lifting and transporting of those thick and sometimes buried rocks. Same happened for me when i carted bucket loads of free river rocks to fill in a small flowerbed section in front next to neighbor. The really fantastic news is that the completed effort will be worth all your time and effort! No bermuda grass encroaching because I dug out the bed deeply and lined it with heavy duty plastic…no idea how deep the rock fill turned out to be but it took daily treks for weeks one summer to retrieve, wash and "build" the bed. Sharp shears prevent encroachement of grass/weeds and hilariously one lone iris sprouted in one tiny corner of the bed!!

I emptied a 40 gallon Rubbermaid container on wheels of maybe 3yrs? worth of moldering leaves. Managed to tip it over and rake out the fabulous leaf mold sitting on the ground but there was residual soggyness (?) lower down which resulted in a very muddy splotched gal. That was ok because I still had to fine spray mist some waiting-to-emerge seedlings and so misted self too which got some mud and made the effort cooler.

You'll be amazed and delighted…as probably will you wife, grins…at your masterful path completion!!! Your fans of both rocks and puzzles, we'll be eagerly waiting and hoping for a photo of your latest masterpiece! Just a thought to consider: one day hard; next day easy??? Sometimes that works.

Liked by lioness

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@fiesty76 Love the way you have with words I love also to start projects like yesterday I had a coloring project , new table to put in place dusted some , never get any of them finished but you know what there is always another day that's the I feel . We built a road with rocks hauled trailer full after trailer full to make that road dog got hit by one of them our son throw . He learned not to be around us after that . lol We made it through another day will see what this brings now . @jimhd there is always another day to finish your rock project . Then satisfaction , you did it yea .

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