Survivors of toxic relationship with a Narcissist: Let's Connect

@diverdown1
Don't they have to be diagnosed? I did mention to attorney that I believe my ex is a narcissist, but attorney just asked if a Dr. diagnosed it. No diagnosis because , ex never sought one. Ex would deny the very thought that he is one.
Does a diagnosis help your case ? Especially if it goes to trial? Can the courts demand a Dr. diagnosed report? Thank you anyone who can answer this

@dyas - Greetings!

I have a couple of Qs, if you are looking to help by sharing some of your experience and life lessons on this topic.

1 - May I ask what happens in an "annual neurological psychological evaluation"? I've contacted a neurologist, but unless something 'medically' is to be discovered, it seems I need to instead find a psychiatrist/psychologist to do an evaluation - specifically, memory issues, lifelong dysthymia, possibly adult ADD? Might help answer some of my lifelong challenges, even possibly help me feel better about my struggles and, at 69, still even move beyond them?

2 - My second Q would be, in awe of your good news and life, as you've described it, coming out of such a horrific childhood experience: how would you (even begin to) address your good fortune in finding a healthy, long-lasting love, and more?

I'll leave it at those 2 Qs for the time being.

I'm thinking that many of us reading/posting in this forum's topic would be interested in how your story developed, and that it would be most helpful to others, even though everyone's life circumstances vary.

But the core of living/growing up with narcissistic parents, even for some of us who knew they loved us and maybe were doing the best they could (easier to say at this age, but still a struggle): the core is so deeply sad, such a waste of a lot of years and opportunities, and such pain that I and my sibling in particular have spent our entire lives wrestling with - to no greater resolution than that it happened, and it continues with our 96+ year old mother in her decline, yet wanting the best for her continues as a driving force in our care and oversight of her declining time.

Such a dichotomy of loss and love, and even worse because no one in the family would acknowledge it; my sibling who has had life & death struggles with the codependency of her relationship with our mother has also lived in fear of - I think - the wrath of our mother if we were to discuss the dysfunction -, and the demise of our (emotionally fragile) mother if any hard yet real struggles were ever brought to light. All in an effort to get beyond it, at least not to feel so alone, isolated, deeply depressed about the struggle and its impact on every facet of our lives.

Ack! Went on longer than I intended to, but not so unusual for me.

If this is not how you meant to be 'of help' to others, completely understand. If there are others who'd care to respond to this kind of lifetime of sadness, in spite of all appearances, I welcome hearing about yours too.

To all who come here in the hope of some relief through sharing, and some connection, I wish you much peace.

@brandysparks Those are great questions. I know that therapy has helped me immensely with ADHD, spinning thoughts, all the different parts of me that learned survival skills (anger, etc.) to deal with growing up with my NPD parent and the dysfunction that went on in my house, growing up, as well as when an adult.

I went from a really kind, sweet, honest child, to a 12 year old that started drinking and smoking. I also became very angry. So, I was acting out (unconsciously) the dysfunction. I was told in treatment at 14 that I was the "scapegoat" in my family. In other words, I was the "problem." The counselors were not saying that I was "the problem" specifically, but that I was the problem my other family members focused on so as not to have to take a look at themselves. So, battling alcoholism and addiction for over 3 decades has been my part. I am sober now and have been for several years now. I still go to therapy. There is complex trauma that is experienced when a family has an NPD parent, sibling, spouse. I am still in therapy and it takes time to get to those emotions of abandonment, sadness, fear, etc., that a little child experiences. Those are such formidable years.

You sound so self aware and I understand and empathize with what you experienced. It is isolating and I know that feeling. There are assessments that can be given in a psychological examination for ADHD, anxiety, depression, PTSD (as complex traumatic stress disorder is only recently recognized as life long trauma). PTSD leans more towards specific events, where as Complex Trauma (CTSD) is more life long trauma, emotional abandonment, neglect, emotional abuse, etc. Growing up in a household with an NPD qualifies (in my opinion and experience. Anyway, thank you for your post. Peace to you also.

@dyas, you are a survivor. Wow!
In what way would you like to help others? Do you mean how might you volunteer your time in your local community?

Naturally, you can also help others here on Mayo Clinic Connect, too. Are you following the support group Aging Well? You might wish to join the discussions in that group, offer your tips and wisdom. 🙂

- Aging Well Support Group https://connect.mayoclinic.org/group/aging-well/

PS: Happy belated birthday.

@dyas, you are a survivor. Wow!
In what way would you like to help others? Do you mean how might you volunteer your time in your local community?

Naturally, you can also help others here on Mayo Clinic Connect, too. Are you following the support group Aging Well? You might wish to join the discussions in that group, offer your tips and wisdom. 🙂

- Aging Well Support Group https://connect.mayoclinic.org/group/aging-well/

PS: Happy belated birthday.

@dyas - Greetings!

I have a couple of Qs, if you are looking to help by sharing some of your experience and life lessons on this topic.

1 - May I ask what happens in an "annual neurological psychological evaluation"? I've contacted a neurologist, but unless something 'medically' is to be discovered, it seems I need to instead find a psychiatrist/psychologist to do an evaluation - specifically, memory issues, lifelong dysthymia, possibly adult ADD? Might help answer some of my lifelong challenges, even possibly help me feel better about my struggles and, at 69, still even move beyond them?

2 - My second Q would be, in awe of your good news and life, as you've described it, coming out of such a horrific childhood experience: how would you (even begin to) address your good fortune in finding a healthy, long-lasting love, and more?

I'll leave it at those 2 Qs for the time being.

I'm thinking that many of us reading/posting in this forum's topic would be interested in how your story developed, and that it would be most helpful to others, even though everyone's life circumstances vary.

But the core of living/growing up with narcissistic parents, even for some of us who knew they loved us and maybe were doing the best they could (easier to say at this age, but still a struggle): the core is so deeply sad, such a waste of a lot of years and opportunities, and such pain that I and my sibling in particular have spent our entire lives wrestling with - to no greater resolution than that it happened, and it continues with our 96+ year old mother in her decline, yet wanting the best for her continues as a driving force in our care and oversight of her declining time.

Such a dichotomy of loss and love, and even worse because no one in the family would acknowledge it; my sibling who has had life & death struggles with the codependency of her relationship with our mother has also lived in fear of - I think - the wrath of our mother if we were to discuss the dysfunction -, and the demise of our (emotionally fragile) mother if any hard yet real struggles were ever brought to light. All in an effort to get beyond it, at least not to feel so alone, isolated, deeply depressed about the struggle and its impact on every facet of our lives.

Ack! Went on longer than I intended to, but not so unusual for me.

If this is not how you meant to be 'of help' to others, completely understand. If there are others who'd care to respond to this kind of lifetime of sadness, in spite of all appearances, I welcome hearing about yours too.

To all who come here in the hope of some relief through sharing, and some connection, I wish you much peace.

@brandysparks Those are great questions. I know that therapy has helped me immensely with ADHD, spinning thoughts, all the different parts of me that learned survival skills (anger, etc.) to deal with growing up with my NPD parent and the dysfunction that went on in my house, growing up, as well as when an adult.

I went from a really kind, sweet, honest child, to a 12 year old that started drinking and smoking. I also became very angry. So, I was acting out (unconsciously) the dysfunction. I was told in treatment at 14 that I was the "scapegoat" in my family. In other words, I was the "problem." The counselors were not saying that I was "the problem" specifically, but that I was the problem my other family members focused on so as not to have to take a look at themselves. So, battling alcoholism and addiction for over 3 decades has been my part. I am sober now and have been for several years now. I still go to therapy. There is complex trauma that is experienced when a family has an NPD parent, sibling, spouse. I am still in therapy and it takes time to get to those emotions of abandonment, sadness, fear, etc., that a little child experiences. Those are such formidable years.

You sound so self aware and I understand and empathize with what you experienced. It is isolating and I know that feeling. There are assessments that can be given in a psychological examination for ADHD, anxiety, depression, PTSD (as complex traumatic stress disorder is only recently recognized as life long trauma). PTSD leans more towards specific events, where as Complex Trauma (CTSD) is more life long trauma, emotional abandonment, neglect, emotional abuse, etc. Growing up in a household with an NPD qualifies (in my opinion and experience. Anyway, thank you for your post. Peace to you also.

@brandysparks Those are great questions. I know that therapy has helped me immensely with ADHD, spinning thoughts, all the different parts of me that learned survival skills (anger, etc.) to deal with growing up with my NPD parent and the dysfunction that went on in my house, growing up, as well as when an adult.

I went from a really kind, sweet, honest child, to a 12 year old that started drinking and smoking. I also became very angry. So, I was acting out (unconsciously) the dysfunction. I was told in treatment at 14 that I was the "scapegoat" in my family. In other words, I was the "problem." The counselors were not saying that I was "the problem" specifically, but that I was the problem my other family members focused on so as not to have to take a look at themselves. So, battling alcoholism and addiction for over 3 decades has been my part. I am sober now and have been for several years now. I still go to therapy. There is complex trauma that is experienced when a family has an NPD parent, sibling, spouse. I am still in therapy and it takes time to get to those emotions of abandonment, sadness, fear, etc., that a little child experiences. Those are such formidable years.

You sound so self aware and I understand and empathize with what you experienced. It is isolating and I know that feeling. There are assessments that can be given in a psychological examination for ADHD, anxiety, depression, PTSD (as complex traumatic stress disorder is only recently recognized as life long trauma). PTSD leans more towards specific events, where as Complex Trauma (CTSD) is more life long trauma, emotional abandonment, neglect, emotional abuse, etc. Growing up in a household with an NPD qualifies (in my opinion and experience. Anyway, thank you for your post. Peace to you also.

@diverdown1
A wonderful article. Really sums up my experiences. Since I had the psychological evaluation so much has happened.
I have decided I will not take another evaluation. I have had previous evaluations. What I observed from the most recent one is a feeling of absolutely no understanding or compassion.

I had just received the wonderful note from Cathleen describing me as a “survivor”. That single word is the greatest compliment I have ever received. I will always remember the moment I read it.
I need to set the scene so everyone understands why the psyche evaluation that day was a perfect storm. In this way I am hoping Mayo might consider what changes might be made in the actual execution of such evaluations.

I had previously completed an assessment form that was very detailed. I have the gift of nearly total recall. This gift I have goes back to my earliest youth. So here I am sitting with the psychiatrist. Her focus was on the form I completed while my focus was on the message from Colleen. I am in tears and the psychiatrist is very upset because I am not answering the questions. This meeting was followed by an experience with a psychologist. I felt like I was under attack. I was so upset that I ended the session.
I assume the techniques used on me are sttandard and approved. If that is the case the n we are in trouble. At no time did anyone ask me, “are you ok Mr Hurt, what’s wrong”.
I will not go back to face another event like I just experienced. What drives this decision is some simply wonderful events Sally and I just experienced. Sal has confronted Pancreatic Cancer for 7+ years. She has this absolutely marvelous oncologist who has been by her side fighting for her. There is a new autoimmune approach being reviewed for ultimate distraction. If approved it will mean the end of CHEMOTHERAPY for her and thousands of others.

Anyway, if anyone has any questions or comments please let me know.

Take very good care and thank you all for your interest and thoughts m.

Namaste 🙏 Mort