1. < Heart & Blood Health

High calcium score: I'm in shock

Posted by sjy70 @sjy70, Jun 14, 2021

Hi everyone... just wanted to share my last few days - I'm scared and lost and was just hoping to hear from some people who have been in my place. Long story short - I went in for a "routine" checkup at age 50 to make sure my heart was okay. I had a stress test two years ago that was fine. But I do have a family history, and somewhat high LDL and blood pressure so the doctor sent me for a cardiac calcium score. It came back at 407 at age 50!!! That's like the 98th percentile for my age, which is shocking. I do Crossfit and have done half marathons so it was totally unexpected. Now I'm going for another stress test in two weeks to make sure no blockages are over 70%, and I'm not sure of the steps after that.... I'm terrified of needing open heart surgery - I've gotten myself into a place of being okay with a stent if needed. I know it's better to know than not know, but I just feel like my life was suddenly ripped out from under me and to be honest I'm spinning right now... every waking second I feel like I'm going to drop over..

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callalloo | @callalloo | Jun 27, 2022
In reply to @kefnb "I respectfully disagree that comments from people who are not “medical professionals” but who are touting..." + (show)
@kefnb

I respectfully disagree that comments from people who are not “medical professionals” but who are touting “ the latest book or podcast by the latest YouTube doc” are whacky.
I’m a registered nurse with a 25-year history of CCICU and SICU experience. That does not make me an MD, but puts me in a position to see the benefits of conventional medicine and it’s failures in this specialty.
I would venture to guess that most people who find their way to this site are not anti-conventional medicine and can think for themselves.
For myself, I explore answers to health issues from a wholistic perspective and I know many doctors who do the same.
I have very high cholesterol and before agreeing to statins I asked for the
CAC and ultrasounds of my carotids and jugular veins. All were perfectly clear. I suspected they would be because decades ago I read an article in the NYTs that the problem with cholesterol may not be the amount of cholesterol but the size. Remembering this, when my cholesterol went up I paid out of pocket to discover the size. They were the large, fluffy kind known not to stick to the arteries.
Now we know of a simple calculation that will indicate the size of your cholesterol:
Divide your triglycerides by your HDL. Lower is better and you want to be below 2 and closer to 1. Mine, with a total cholesterol consistently over 300 is 1 or just below 1.
I offer these comments in the spirit of encouraging people to keep an open mind and in hopes that people will continue to offer information they have come across that they think make sense or would like feedback on.
BTW, I think that Vitamin K2 has played a part in keeping my arteries clear.

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I have a similar situation and was a patient of the physician who developed the CAC. [He's a great doctor but no longer geographically-accessible.]

I have high cholesterol but continue to have excellent echocardiograms, Endopat results and a low CAC of 4. Dr. A. ordered the then-available Berkeley cardiology profile and the explanation for the good test results was in the percentage of larger-molecule, non-sticky cholesterol. Since I can't tolerate statins anyway, and have the genetic market for heart disease, those fluffy molecules are good news indeed.

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kefnb | @kefnb | Jun 28, 2022
In reply to @janet23 "My CAC score decreased from 199 to 18 after I started Vitamin K2 mk7. I have..." + (show)
@janet23

My CAC score decreased from
199 to 18 after I started Vitamin K2 mk7. I have high cholesterol, high LDL, and high HDL. My TG/HDL is 0.9. I don’t like to take statins because they have caused worsening neuropathy in my feet in the past. However, I am back on a very low statin dose because I have soft plaque developing according to a recent CT Angio, and a low carb diet. I need to lose a few pounds.

I order my advanced lipid labs through Ulta Lab Tests. https://www.ultalabtests.com for a big discount. You can shop on their site for discount coupons. They do not bill insurance and you don’t need a doctor’s order in most states. The CardioIQ panels are run at Quest Cleveland Heart Lab. Most doctors are reluctant to order the advanced CardioIQ labs because Medicare and many other insurers won’t pay for them.

The Quest Cardio IQ advanced panels give you a more detailed breakdown of your particle size. I am Pattern A. I order panel 94220 which includes hsCRP.

https://www.questdiagnostics.com/healthcare-professionals/about-our-tests/cardiovascular/cardio-iq-report

This may be a helpful option. I have a strong immune system and LDL plays an importent role in the process. I don’t want my LDL too low and I like the option of monitoring my own lipids. I have been able to order a simple cholesterol panel for $15 with a coupon plus a $8 lab draw fee. I do the more advanced panel once a year, which is more expensive.

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Hi Jane,
What brand of k2/MK7 do you take? I take Thorne d3/ k2-as mk7.
I had been taking it for years prior to having my CAC.

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1 reply
Myak | @janet23 | Jun 29, 2022
In reply to @kefnb "Hi Jane, What brand of k2/MK7 do you take? I take Thorne d3/ k2-as mk7. I..." + (show)
@kefnb

Hi Jane,
What brand of k2/MK7 do you take? I take Thorne d3/ k2-as mk7.
I had been taking it for years prior to having my CAC.

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I take one Sports Nutrition Research Vitamin K2 MK7 each day that I buy on Amazon, and 6000 IUs of Vitamin D3 that I buy at Costco plus a Multivitamin because my vitamin D levels run low; I am very sun-sensitive and I need to stay out of the sun. My vitamin D levels are stable at 60 taking these two vitamins, and so is my osteopenia. I see a physical therapist for strength training exercises and get a bone density study every two years.

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markdeegan | @markdeegan | Jun 30, 2022

My friend Forget the stress test.
They are not reliable.
Get a CT-A

Its a picture of whats in your coronary arteries.

A high CAC is a serious thing. But calcified plaque is accomponied by the dangerous unstable plaque also.

You need crestor and maybe Zetia on top of it. You can actually lower the unstable plaque and live until yr 80 or so. But expect your cac score to go up alot more. Read Dr Esselstyn books and go on Crestor. Dont believe the BS about statins. You already have CAD. You need to stop the LDL build up.

Contact me with questions
Im not a Dr but will do my best.
I had the same experience
Markdeegan@yahoo.com

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callalloo | @callalloo | Jul 1, 2022

There are people who simply cannot tolerate statins. I'm one of them. I have tried every one on the market and all of them caused horrendous leg cramping. I mean the kind of cramp where the ankle bends forward so toes are trying to reach shinbone and knee bends so severe that my heel was essentially trying to reach the thigh back. Essentially, my leg accordion pleated and the pain was frightening. I almost called 911 once because I was afraid that I could permanently damage muscles or tendons. (I later found that severe enough cramping can actually do that. ) My cardiologist has other patients who've had the same reaction to those drugs.

I never had a leg cramp in my life before playing with statins. It's been four years since I last took one and the cramps have, slowly, become less severe and less frequent. Buy they're not 100% gone yet either. I've never found the explanation for how/why statins can do this, but it's not uncommon.

For others who have this issue, I've found that I can stop a cramp if, at the very first twitch/sensation, I immediately grab an ice pack and essentially 'pet' (think stroking a puppy) the whole length of the leg. IF I can ice the area soon enough, the full cramp never materializes and muscles slowly reverse the seizing-up process. But the fact that statins caused this intense trigger reaction that is tenacious enough to still cause a problem after this much time is curious to me.
What else do those drugs do?

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1 reply
mayoconnectuser1 | @mayoconnectuser1 | Jul 1, 2022
In reply to @callalloo "There are people who simply cannot tolerate statins. I'm one of them. I have tried every..." + (show)
@callalloo

There are people who simply cannot tolerate statins. I'm one of them. I have tried every one on the market and all of them caused horrendous leg cramping. I mean the kind of cramp where the ankle bends forward so toes are trying to reach shinbone and knee bends so severe that my heel was essentially trying to reach the thigh back. Essentially, my leg accordion pleated and the pain was frightening. I almost called 911 once because I was afraid that I could permanently damage muscles or tendons. (I later found that severe enough cramping can actually do that. ) My cardiologist has other patients who've had the same reaction to those drugs.

I never had a leg cramp in my life before playing with statins. It's been four years since I last took one and the cramps have, slowly, become less severe and less frequent. Buy they're not 100% gone yet either. I've never found the explanation for how/why statins can do this, but it's not uncommon.

For others who have this issue, I've found that I can stop a cramp if, at the very first twitch/sensation, I immediately grab an ice pack and essentially 'pet' (think stroking a puppy) the whole length of the leg. IF I can ice the area soon enough, the full cramp never materializes and muscles slowly reverse the seizing-up process. But the fact that statins caused this intense trigger reaction that is tenacious enough to still cause a problem after this much time is curious to me.
What else do those drugs do?

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Given your knowledge of potential side effects, your last quest is perplexing callalloo. You are asking what statins "do?"

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1 reply
callalloo | @callalloo | Jul 1, 2022
In reply to @mayoconnectuser1 "Given your knowledge of potential side effects, your last quest is perplexing callalloo. You are asking..." + (show)
@mayoconnectuser1

Given your knowledge of potential side effects, your last quest is perplexing callalloo. You are asking what statins "do?"

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This was directed at someone whose doctor has suggested starting statins. A good question to ask the doctor, in addition to the known side effects, is exactly how do the drugs work and what do they actually do...what causes the not uncommon side effect of muscle cramping and worse?

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1 reply
mayoconnectuser1 | @mayoconnectuser1 | Jul 2, 2022
In reply to @callalloo "This was directed at someone whose doctor has suggested starting statins. A good question to ask..." + (show)
@callalloo

This was directed at someone whose doctor has suggested starting statins. A good question to ask the doctor, in addition to the known side effects, is exactly how do the drugs work and what do they actually do...what causes the not uncommon side effect of muscle cramping and worse?

Jump to this post

Well, sure, but the first thing to do is to read the various major, independent studies that have been conducted - compare the basic findings to your particular circumstances - in order to have a substantive conversation with your doctor.

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1 reply
callalloo | @callalloo | Jul 2, 2022
In reply to @mayoconnectuser1 "Well, sure, but the first thing to do is to read the various major, independent studies..." + (show)
@mayoconnectuser1

Well, sure, but the first thing to do is to read the various major, independent studies that have been conducted - compare the basic findings to your particular circumstances - in order to have a substantive conversation with your doctor.

Jump to this post

I agree. I'm a researcher by habit, and career, and endorse anything to make client/patients better-informed purchasers of medical care of any kind. It amazes me when people don't question their doctors and just assume they are all-aware.
I assume my (current) doctors are excellent. But human and can have a bad day or be imperfectly attentive or not yet read the latest issues of med journals because the doctors are swamped with daily minutiae and insurance changes and also have private lives that need attention. So I like to reconfirm stuff and know we're on the same page. It helps to have a doctor who appreciates a pro-active patient as a good patient, likely to actually act on agreed-upon treatment plan. 😏

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maggiemarie | @maggiemarie | Aug 11, 2022

Interesting account. My husband has been on a great diet for 10 years: gluten-free, sugar-free, dairy-free, all organic fruits and vegetables, snacks on nuts, etc. His fat intake is from Olive oil and flaxseed oil. His weight is good. Went to doctor because of extreme tiredness and was sent for CAC score testing. He’s 74 and we were shocked to see his score was 803! It makes no sense! His LDL is high (153), but his HDL and triglycerides are excellent. From what I’ve read, statins will lower LDL, but raise CAC! He goes in for his stress test next week to determine if there are any blockages. We’re baffled!

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