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patrick17
@patrick17

Posts: 29
Joined: Jun 02, 2018

HF 10 Spinal Cord Stimulation Device (Relieves back and leg pain)

Posted by @patrick17, Wed, Nov 21 10:00pm

Has anyone tried a device called HF 10 ? It’s a device which stimulates your spinal cord to help relieve back and leg pain. After a trial period of about a week, if the patient is achieving good results the device is implanted in the person. My pain management doctor has recommended it to me for arm and hand nerve pain. I would like to hear from anyone who has used this device and especially from anyone who has used it for arm and hand pain. Thank you.

REPLY

Hi, over the years I’ve had 3 dorsal column Stimulators (2 made by Medtronic the other by Nevro). I found them to be quite affective however please be very stringent in researching any kind of implanted pain device because many of them are not MRI Compatable. I ended up having emergency surgery to have my all my devices and leads removed so I could receive treatment for severe spinal instability.
I’d been complaining of my back feeling like a concertina that was going to collapse at any time. Of course I didn’t know at the time but that was exactly what was happening. One day I lost bowel/bladder control and it suddenly became a medical emergency. The devices were removed, MRI performed and before I knew it I was having a 6 level spinal fusion.
Even if you are told the device is MEI Compatable ring a few radiology/imaging places and ask then if they do MRI’s with pain devices. Many won’t even though some device company’s approve them. 9 mths prior to my back surgery I had brain surgery across the other side of Australia because no radiology would do a Cranial MRI where I live. Over 4000 to be able to have an MRI.

My pain specialist who put the stimulator in was hesitant to remove it because it was so difficult to put in in the first place. Perhaps if it had been removed earlier I wouldn’t have ended up with such complex circumstances surrounding both brain and spinal surgery. It’s important to remember that if you need one of these devices you probably have chronic pain and your condition may require ongoing imaging to monitor whatever condition it. Please check and double check the information you’re given, I would hate anyone to have to go through what I did

Wise advice, @sallymagint. It is so important to research when comparing medical devices.

Patrick, you may be interested in reading this blog post
– New Developments in Spinal Stimulation for Pain Management https://connect.mayoclinic.org/page/adult-pain-medicine/newsfeed/new-developments-in-spinal-stimulation/

By the way, the Adult Pain Medicine is a new page and blog on Connect. Follow the page to get notifications each time a new blog is posted (weekly).
– Adult Pain Medicine https://connect.mayoclinic.org/page/adult-pain-medicine/

My pain management specialist is recommending a BurstDR stimulation implant for pain control following six unsuccessful spinal injection procedures that provided no relief from postherpetic neuralgia in the perineal area (rectal/scrotum) with nerve damage from severe case of shingles over a year ago. I am taking gabapentin and tramadol that provide slight pain relief but the area of nerve damage is still quite painful, especially when sitting. Has anyone else gone through this lifestyle-changing condition?

@sallymagint

Hi, over the years I’ve had 3 dorsal column Stimulators (2 made by Medtronic the other by Nevro). I found them to be quite affective however please be very stringent in researching any kind of implanted pain device because many of them are not MRI Compatable. I ended up having emergency surgery to have my all my devices and leads removed so I could receive treatment for severe spinal instability.
I’d been complaining of my back feeling like a concertina that was going to collapse at any time. Of course I didn’t know at the time but that was exactly what was happening. One day I lost bowel/bladder control and it suddenly became a medical emergency. The devices were removed, MRI performed and before I knew it I was having a 6 level spinal fusion.
Even if you are told the device is MEI Compatable ring a few radiology/imaging places and ask then if they do MRI’s with pain devices. Many won’t even though some device company’s approve them. 9 mths prior to my back surgery I had brain surgery across the other side of Australia because no radiology would do a Cranial MRI where I live. Over 4000 to be able to have an MRI.

My pain specialist who put the stimulator in was hesitant to remove it because it was so difficult to put in in the first place. Perhaps if it had been removed earlier I wouldn’t have ended up with such complex circumstances surrounding both brain and spinal surgery. It’s important to remember that if you need one of these devices you probably have chronic pain and your condition may require ongoing imaging to monitor whatever condition it. Please check and double check the information you’re given, I would hate anyone to have to go through what I did

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Thank you for your response and advice. The unit my doctor recommended is made by Nevro. I read the information sheet about MRIs and there were lots of conditions with it. I’ll speak to my doctor about it. I’m sorry for all of your health issues, I hope you’re having less pain now.
I see that in the Chronic Pain discussion group there is a discussion about spinal cord stimulators. Perhaps that’s where I should have posted this.

@patrick17

Thank you for your response and advice. The unit my doctor recommended is made by Nevro. I read the information sheet about MRIs and there were lots of conditions with it. I’ll speak to my doctor about it. I’m sorry for all of your health issues, I hope you’re having less pain now.
I see that in the Chronic Pain discussion group there is a discussion about spinal cord stimulators. Perhaps that’s where I should have posted this.

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@patrick17 there is absolutely no doubt the devices had a positive outcome for pain management, especially with the damage I was left with following earlier Spinal trauma. In this respect I highly recommend them. It was just very unfortunate that it meant I could not have an MRI which would have picked up the other deficits I was suffering from earlier.
I can only hope that future developments in pain management come up with a similar device that is MRI compatiable because they really can be very beneficial.

In terms of the different types, the two brands were very different. The Medtronic ones I could feel the tingling in the areas the device was programmed to focus. The Nevro was a high frequency one so I couldn’t feel it working. In terms of the two different devices the Medtronic was good in the sense that each time the cycle stopped/started I would feel it kick in. Of course over time I became semi conscious of this happening so there was no thought process about it. If my pain was really bad I could use the remote to increase or change to another program to seek relief and would feel it tingle faster, stronger etc… The Nevro gave better pain relief for me overall even though I couldn’t actually feel it. Again I could increase or change the program to fit with the varied levels of pain. It really helped with nerve pain in legs/back and neuropathy in feet.
I do remember when it was suggested we try the Nevro and I read all the info, I thought ‘I’m not sure how this is going to work because if I can’t feel is working how is it going to change the pain?’ I was was pleasantly surprised how much it did help.

Whatever you decide make sure you research and ask questions of Drs and other patients who have used pain devices – good luck

@sallymagint

@patrick17 there is absolutely no doubt the devices had a positive outcome for pain management, especially with the damage I was left with following earlier Spinal trauma. In this respect I highly recommend them. It was just very unfortunate that it meant I could not have an MRI which would have picked up the other deficits I was suffering from earlier.
I can only hope that future developments in pain management come up with a similar device that is MRI compatiable because they really can be very beneficial.

In terms of the different types, the two brands were very different. The Medtronic ones I could feel the tingling in the areas the device was programmed to focus. The Nevro was a high frequency one so I couldn’t feel it working. In terms of the two different devices the Medtronic was good in the sense that each time the cycle stopped/started I would feel it kick in. Of course over time I became semi conscious of this happening so there was no thought process about it. If my pain was really bad I could use the remote to increase or change to another program to seek relief and would feel it tingle faster, stronger etc… The Nevro gave better pain relief for me overall even though I couldn’t actually feel it. Again I could increase or change the program to fit with the varied levels of pain. It really helped with nerve pain in legs/back and neuropathy in feet.
I do remember when it was suggested we try the Nevro and I read all the info, I thought ‘I’m not sure how this is going to work because if I can’t feel is working how is it going to change the pain?’ I was was pleasantly surprised how much it did help.

Whatever you decide make sure you research and ask questions of Drs and other patients who have used pain devices – good luck

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Thanks again for all your good information! I really appreciate it. I’ve been reading as much as I can about it on the internet. MayfieldClinic.com has an excellent explanation of these devices. I still am unable to find any mention of this by someone who has been helped by this for arm and hand pain. It’s scary to me to have the wires and leads put in so near my spine. I don’t want to come home in worse condition. I trust my doctor and I will ask him a lot of questions when I see him. I may seek a second opinion from another doctor in the area who also implants Nevro devices.

I had much of the same questions posted here. My doctor recommended i look to Mayo clinlic boards to get unbiased feedback because he's recommending a pain implant as i was just diagnosed with arachoiditis and have had tons of injections over the last four years as well as two surgeries on my spine. I've never had this kind of pain, however I also have an LP shunt in my lower back due to another rare disease so now i'm not sure what to do ro where to turn as far as information. Thank you for the feedback ya'll posted.

@chriyo33

I had much of the same questions posted here. My doctor recommended i look to Mayo clinlic boards to get unbiased feedback because he's recommending a pain implant as i was just diagnosed with arachoiditis and have had tons of injections over the last four years as well as two surgeries on my spine. I've never had this kind of pain, however I also have an LP shunt in my lower back due to another rare disease so now i'm not sure what to do ro where to turn as far as information. Thank you for the feedback ya'll posted.

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I’m sorry for your pain and back condition. It must be an awful thing to live with. From what I have read, the Nevro HF10 has been very successful at helping people with back pain. The good thing is that you can do a trial first and the procedure is reversable if there are problems.
There is a doctor I have discovered on YouTube who has made several videos about spinal cord stimulators including the Nevro HF10. His name is Dr. William Porter McRoberts and he is on YouTube under Anodyne Research. His website is internationalhouseofpain.com His videos and information are excellent. Another informative website I’ve found is mayfieldclinic.com
You can also find individuals who have tried spinal cord stimulators and have posted YouTube videos describing their experiences.
I hope this information helps. Good luck!

My wife has chronic pain and considered a spinal implant device. After doing much research and talking to some doctors I found the following. There are older and newer model devices out there. The newer claim to work better even though the process of implant is the same so I'm not sure why the newer claims are better. Second is that there (according to a doctor) is a high re-implant rate in the first 5 years (20%) apparently to readjust the spinal implants. Third is there probably are no studies done on other parts of the body other than that of the spinal/back and leg. My wife's pain area was never studied so she would be the first to test these devices for her pain area. From what I've read pain in the arm areas was never mentioned. Finally I tried to get clinical study side affect data on more severe side affects like paralysis which a neighbor down the street from us incurred as a result of an implant procedure. None of the companies would provide such data. So I don't know how to view the probability of this severe side affect from occurring.

So while many have had success with these devices we decided not to go through this procedure due to the many unknowns at hand.

Thanks, @bkruppa, for sharing the research you have done related to a possible spinal implant device for your wife's chronic pain. What direction are you looking to go next for pain control?

@chriyo33. Are you currently leaning toward or against the pain implant?

That's a good question. We've gone through all the vitamin, pain meds, acupuncture, laser massages, caudal nerve blocks, pudendal nerve blocks, MRIs, X-Rays, etc. treatments to find relief or source of the problem but so far come up with nothing. From other research that I've done I'm leaning towards nerve entrapment as being the possible cause of my wife's pain. There are a lot of articles referencing PNE or Pudendal Nerve Entrapment as a cause of this pain. It is quite common and there are clinics around the country who treat such conditions. In these cases the cure is to remove the entrapment source which usually is a muscle tightening up and causing pressure on the pudendal nerve. The symptoms of PNE are exactly like what my wife has. However, most doctors are not supportive of this.

I was told by a Physical Therapist that pain due to a torn rotator cuff and then scar tissue entrapping a nerve is common. So I'm still leaning in the direction of PNE. We are also looking into inversion tables which can stretch the spinal column such that if there is an entrapped nerve this possibly will help the condition. As we age the body and muscles starts to shrink which can put undue pressure on nerves, spinal areas, etc..

Another pain doctor says that the source of PNE is at the spinal column (root of the nerve) and wants to do a spinal injection of a steroid to see if this gives some relief. However, this is not a permanent solution and would have to be repeated continuously over time. While we may try this I will still try to find a solution rather than using meds which only gives temporary relief.

I myself have had in the past excruciating lower back pain. It was like someone stuck an ice pick in my spinal column. Doctors prescribed pain meds and muscle relaxers but neither gave one bit of relief. I read about simple muscle stretching exercises in this area, tried it during an episode, and it worked like a miracle. Apparently what happens is if these muscles tighten from exercise, working, or whatever they will put pressure on the nerves and cause pain so bad you can't move. Whether this is due to entrapment or compression of the spinal column I don't know but stretching works for me. I told friends that I would rather pass two kidney stones then have this lower back pain.:):) I also totally relieved pain in my hip and knee areas using simple stretching routines. So for my condition stretching certain muscle groups has been the solution. But it won't work for all nerve pain conditions such as arthritic conditions where you have bone on bone conditions.

@bkruppa

My wife has chronic pain and considered a spinal implant device. After doing much research and talking to some doctors I found the following. There are older and newer model devices out there. The newer claim to work better even though the process of implant is the same so I'm not sure why the newer claims are better. Second is that there (according to a doctor) is a high re-implant rate in the first 5 years (20%) apparently to readjust the spinal implants. Third is there probably are no studies done on other parts of the body other than that of the spinal/back and leg. My wife's pain area was never studied so she would be the first to test these devices for her pain area. From what I've read pain in the arm areas was never mentioned. Finally I tried to get clinical study side affect data on more severe side affects like paralysis which a neighbor down the street from us incurred as a result of an implant procedure. None of the companies would provide such data. So I don't know how to view the probability of this severe side affect from occurring.

So while many have had success with these devices we decided not to go through this procedure due to the many unknowns at hand.

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Thank you for your response and input. I am sorry for your wife’s pain. I read your other message and see that you and your wife have been through the mill. I am still undecided about a spinal cord stimulator. I am trying to connect with someone with arm and hand pain who has been helped by the Nevro device. The website below talks of a study of patients with neck and arm pain who had good results with the Nevro HF10. I don’t know anything more about it other than what I’ve read here. One question I have is how many patients were in the trial. It only states that 47 patients had the devices implanted.

https://blog.smarttrak.com/high-frequency-scs-for-upper-limb-and-neck-pain-an-interview-with-kas-amirdelfan-md

To me 47 patients in the trial to me is an very low number to make any kind of statistical conclusions about its effectiveness. However, even with this low number I would question the manufacturer and those conducting the trial as to ALL of the negative side effects. In our case neither of the two companies who were contenders for the implant would provide me with this information. I had to find this information with extensive research on the Internet and then with a neighbor down the street from us who became paralyzed as a result of this procedure. Then a doctor at the Mayo Clinic filled us in on the other negatives of this procedure.

I have a friend who currently is suffering from arm pain and tremors. So far meds has been his only treatment/solution. I suspect (but can't confirm) that this may have resulted from nerve entrapment since he for years was engaged in intense weight lifting to bulk up his arms/chest. He also has rotator cuff issues so I suspect (but can't confirm) this was another affected of his weight lifting activities. While I'm no expert nerve entrapment makes a lot of sense to me and it can easily occur if we don't take care of our muscular/nerve/spinal system. I'm all for finding the source of an issue if it can be found with today's technology. The second problem is finding a doctor who will spend sufficient time in this area to see if indeed this is the source of the pain you are experiencing.

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