Anyone else out there with extremely high lipoprotein (a)?

Posted by csage1010 (Sue) @csage1010, Feb 21, 2022

Hi! I just found out that I have an extremely high lipoprotein (a) of 515 nmol/L. I'm terrified; it's that high. I'm 58 years old and my total cholesterol is 212. My LDL is 141, and my HDL is just 40. My cholesterol/HDL ratio is 5.3. Of course it's a long weekend and I may not be able to reach my doctor tomorrow. I have watched a couple of informational sessions online from various doctors discussing elevated LP(a), but no one mentions anything close to how high mine is. Is there anyone else out there with severely elevated Lp(a)? Thanking you in advance. Sue M.

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I am Jewish. And it, unfortunately is all too important to dismiss. I am sorry you are offended. My family died both from the Holocaust and Pogroms. When these poor immigrant families came here, they ate margarine. Only margarine. It was cheap, and it was poison for them. After I was educated about the evils of trans fats -- it was still impossible to get them to change. It saddened me to see the heart disease occurring. I also went on to look at DNA of Jews for purposes of cancer (BRCA 1/2), vascular heart disease (which I unfortunately inherited); lactose intolerance (which I, unfortunately, could not avoid inheriting because both mother and father had the gene) and gluten intolerance - for which I now understand the eating habits in my family. I help others to TRY to see the DNA and hereditary problems caused by interbreeding within DNA pools. So, although I am so sorry you are offended, there is some aspect of truth in the statement. I had meant to include that I was Jewish but I got distracted. For some reason, I can't edit this post? Let me just say that growing up an artist -- everyone is offended by everything. But the value of the post as a whole should NOT be removed, the fact that I did NOT mean to insult to you -- and that we should "never forget" these things -- I hope will offer some catharsis and peace.

REPLY
@whineboy

The health benefits of corn oil and corn oil margearine were debunked in the suppressed 1968-73 Minnesota Coronary Experiment, which only came to light around 2016.
https://www.bmj.com/content/353/bmj.i1246
Me, I stick with olive and avocado oil, butter, ghee, a little bacon fat. No seed oils, all are processed and unstable.
I’ve been very low carb for 5+ years.
TC 150, HDL 79, LDL 59, TGs 58. CAC 1124 (2021).
Rosuvastatin 5 mg, ezetimibe 5 mg (split).

Jump to this post

that study included margarine. (1968 - 73) and made it invaluable and irrelevant. I studied at the end of the 1970s when it was known that transfats metabolized worse than saturated fats. They were eventually taken off the market!
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6168703/
These are far more current and accepted:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27677368/
I love ghee. (but its just for the butter flavor! I am nondairy (inheriting a lactose and now casein problem!)
The one thing about taking nutritional chemistry was that it taught me how things digest. A dietician/nutritionalist learns more "trending" info. I learned the chemistry of the digestive process. That is still, after 50 years is still constant. The mechanisms of digestion. Fads/trends are removed. The body still operates best on a mixed diet of carb, protein, and fat. People do have metabolic issues requiring adjustment, and the American diet finds people consuming too much carb and simple sugar. But a balanced "Mediterranean" style diet is optimal for the "normal" person. Geriatric age nee higher protein levels than they used when younger and need to address the deterioration in digestive ability. Older people need to supplement as well and eat slower to masticate their food to grab all the nutrients possible. A low-carb diet "may be" detrimental if supplementation is not done for the loss of fiber, vitamins, and minerals found only in carbs/supplementation. I know quite a few people who thought the Keto diet was a magic bullet only to find out it backfired as they put on unhealthy weight and raised lipid/glucose levels! As an older person who no longer has muscularity and works outdoors, I rely on those carbs to "hold water" as opposed to the proteins and fats which release water during digestion and cause dehydration!

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@loriesco

Actually - I would tell you from my own experience: the triglycerides are ignored if the Cholesterol is in reason. Triglyceride increase can be a sign of other things. A low carb diet is simply not the answer. Tryglicerides are kinda like a fat, but not exactly. They metabolize better when we are young and not so well when we are older. They can signal a metabolic disorder. https://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/high-blood-triglycerides#:~:text=Triglycerides%20are%20a%20type%20of,does%20not%20need%20right%20away.
Re: Corn oil is an EXCELLENT way to lower serum cholesterol, has healthy linoleic acid, and has a high smoke point! So many, many great things about it - Grandma was right even though she didn't know it!:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2258533/#:~:text=Refined%20corn%20oil%20is%20composed,n%2D3%20ratio%20of%2083.
As far as the hexanes - there are different types - and you are right they should be replaced. I don't consume much oil except during the holidays when cooking, but I use very high-quality oils to be sure! I'll check out the book! Always interested in learning more!

Jump to this post

The health benefits of corn oil and corn oil margearine were debunked in the suppressed 1968-73 Minnesota Coronary Experiment, which only came to light around 2016.
https://www.bmj.com/content/353/bmj.i1246
Me, I stick with olive and avocado oil, butter, ghee, a little bacon fat. No seed oils, all are processed and unstable.
I’ve been very low carb for 5+ years.
TC 150, HDL 79, LDL 59, TGs 58. CAC 1124 (2021).
Rosuvastatin 5 mg, ezetimibe 5 mg (split).

REPLY

Actually - I would tell you from my own experience: the triglycerides are ignored if the Cholesterol is in reason. Triglyceride increase can be a sign of other things. A low carb diet is simply not the answer. Tryglicerides are kinda like a fat, but not exactly. They metabolize better when we are young and not so well when we are older. They can signal a metabolic disorder. https://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/high-blood-triglycerides#:~:text=Triglycerides%20are%20a%20type%20of,does%20not%20need%20right%20away.
Re: Corn oil is an EXCELLENT way to lower serum cholesterol, has healthy linoleic acid, and has a high smoke point! So many, many great things about it - Grandma was right even though she didn't know it!:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/2258533/#:~:text=Refined%20corn%20oil%20is%20composed,n%2D3%20ratio%20of%2083.
As far as the hexanes - there are different types - and you are right they should be replaced. I don't consume much oil except during the holidays when cooking, but I use very high-quality oils to be sure! I'll check out the book! Always interested in learning more!

REPLY
@loriesco

just a quick follow up: its LEVQIO (I not 1) . I took nutritional chemistry at SDSU in the 1970s.
The type of fats is important. People don't realize that cholesterol in eggs does not deposit as the same in one's body. It must be broken into components and remade for your body's signature cholesterol. So when people eat the elements of cholesterol, mistakenly thinking they are better instead of the cholesterol they are providing their body with easy to assemble pieces!
We use corn oil for cooking and olive oil (cold first press) for uncooked uses and sesame oil for particular flavoring. Thats it.
There is not really something called "cholesterol disease" per say, there are types of diseases where plaque is the culprit. We simplify in science by looking at cholesterol as a total. but Drs use the LDL and HDL as a ratio to find out if one's cholesterol is "bad." Further, there are multiple other indicators now like various lipid panels which complete the picture. DNA testing was super helpful for me to determine I inherited the vascular artery disease.
The way I learned it: polyunsaturated oils were best because they effected GOOD change on cholesterol the body would otherwise make, monosaturated were neutral (like coconut/olive) and saturated fats are the worst because they contribute the most damaging elements in the same punch. Transfats - it goes without saying was superbad contributing to heart disease and has since been outlawed.
I trim all the fats from my meats. I eat meat because of my anemia so I can get HEME iron most easily. Wanna share the book you wrote with us? 😉

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For my particular metabolic issues, it's the sugar-fat combo that's really deadly, ie triglycerides. A lot of doctors don't bother so much with cholesterol numbers as long as the triglycerides are good - most easily accomplished on a low-carb diet.
Not sure where the corn oil recommendation is coming from - I have not seen that before. I like avocado oil a lot, but if it's mass-produced it will have bits of the seed in it, which is very bitter and so requires treatment with hexane, a dry cleaning chemical. The same thing used in vegetable oil.
The old fats book is called GOOD FAT, from Scribner. It focuses on the good fats and is designed for a broad audience, meaning cats and dogs can read it, as it focuses on actual food for fat sources.

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@stuffy

Yes!! to bio-identical hormones! That's what I learned when I researched the Pill question (I turn 86 in a couple of weeks, so this was a much bigger mystery then for me). I've been on either Armour thyroid or compounded thyroid and Biest (80-20) ever since.
There is a lot more individual biochemistry than one might imagine. My father too had his first heart attack in his 50s, and several more before he died at 89. He had low blood pressure, while everyone else in the family had high blood pressure.
I also learned that I am incredibly sensitive to carbs - first from a medical psychic in California, soon confirmed by an actual doctor who told me I was pre-diabetic. In the course of eating low-carb I had to deal with a number of other doctors who swore this would kill me. I thought they could be right, so I needed to research fats. That's how I discovered that the most important factor was fat: and surprisingly to many, it turns out that the healthiest fat is natural fat in its natural state, not
processed or manipulated. This fat is crucial for basic health - the function of hormones, absorption of some vitamins and other nutrients, and the cell walls themselves. Butter. Olive oil. Macadamia oil. Coconut oil. Not seed oils or "vegetable oil", which is banned in my kitchen but ubiquitous everywhere else. Fortunately I had a good friend who was a major figure at the Howard Hughes Institute in Berkeley who could explain to me that the good natural fats protect our cell walls and keep them flexible. Oxidized fat is very bad for this process - and the research on eggs, for instance, was done on powdered eggs for convenience in the lab, which is probably how eggs became the devil, despite the fact that the healthiest people in the world, the Japanese and the French, also eat the most eggs. I published a book on my research and was lucky to get an introduction from Dr. Barry Sears at Harvard, a leading figure in the field of fats research. I still think the quality of the fats in your diet is the single most important element.
Later I went to a noted diagnostician at UNC who famously threatened to sue anyone who tested his cholesterol levels. He gave me some unusual tests but didn't find anything unusual. I banned cholesterol tests too, though I allow them now that I know more is better for most women - but yes, not for those who have genetic cholesterol disease.
I will check out LEVQ10 - thank you!!

Jump to this post

just a quick follow up: its LEVQIO (I not 1) . I took nutritional chemistry at SDSU in the 1970s.
The type of fats is important. People don't realize that cholesterol in eggs does not deposit as the same in one's body. It must be broken into components and remade for your body's signature cholesterol. So when people eat the elements of cholesterol, mistakenly thinking they are better instead of the cholesterol they are providing their body with easy to assemble pieces!
We use corn oil for cooking and olive oil (cold first press) for uncooked uses and sesame oil for particular flavoring. Thats it.
There is not really something called "cholesterol disease" per say, there are types of diseases where plaque is the culprit. We simplify in science by looking at cholesterol as a total. but Drs use the LDL and HDL as a ratio to find out if one's cholesterol is "bad." Further, there are multiple other indicators now like various lipid panels which complete the picture. DNA testing was super helpful for me to determine I inherited the vascular artery disease.
The way I learned it: polyunsaturated oils were best because they effected GOOD change on cholesterol the body would otherwise make, monosaturated were neutral (like coconut/olive) and saturated fats are the worst because they contribute the most damaging elements in the same punch. Transfats - it goes without saying was superbad contributing to heart disease and has since been outlawed.
I trim all the fats from my meats. I eat meat because of my anemia so I can get HEME iron most easily. Wanna share the book you wrote with us? 😉

REPLY
@loriesco

wow. what a story. I have similar. What I say is that I'm lucky to be "rescued" at the perfect time. Because medicine evolves. You kiss a lot of frogs to get to the prince (if you don't die in the process!) and then you help others. High cholesterol might keep some alive (I watched a PBS documentary) but those of us with cardiovascular disease markers - it kills. So low cholesterol it must be for sure.
Yes, gotta to find your "princes (princesses) in the medical world!

Jump to this post

Yes!! to bio-identical hormones! That's what I learned when I researched the Pill question (I turn 86 in a couple of weeks, so this was a much bigger mystery then for me). I've been on either Armour thyroid or compounded thyroid and Biest (80-20) ever since.
There is a lot more individual biochemistry than one might imagine. My father too had his first heart attack in his 50s, and several more before he died at 89. He had low blood pressure, while everyone else in the family had high blood pressure.
I also learned that I am incredibly sensitive to carbs - first from a medical psychic in California, soon confirmed by an actual doctor who told me I was pre-diabetic. In the course of eating low-carb I had to deal with a number of other doctors who swore this would kill me. I thought they could be right, so I needed to research fats. That's how I discovered that the most important factor was fat: and surprisingly to many, it turns out that the healthiest fat is natural fat in its natural state, not
processed or manipulated. This fat is crucial for basic health - the function of hormones, absorption of some vitamins and other nutrients, and the cell walls themselves. Butter. Olive oil. Macadamia oil. Coconut oil. Not seed oils or "vegetable oil", which is banned in my kitchen but ubiquitous everywhere else. Fortunately I had a good friend who was a major figure at the Howard Hughes Institute in Berkeley who could explain to me that the good natural fats protect our cell walls and keep them flexible. Oxidized fat is very bad for this process - and the research on eggs, for instance, was done on powdered eggs for convenience in the lab, which is probably how eggs became the devil, despite the fact that the healthiest people in the world, the Japanese and the French, also eat the most eggs. I published a book on my research and was lucky to get an introduction from Dr. Barry Sears at Harvard, a leading figure in the field of fats research. I still think the quality of the fats in your diet is the single most important element.
Later I went to a noted diagnostician at UNC who famously threatened to sue anyone who tested his cholesterol levels. He gave me some unusual tests but didn't find anything unusual. I banned cholesterol tests too, though I allow them now that I know more is better for most women - but yes, not for those who have genetic cholesterol disease.
I will check out LEVQ10 - thank you!!

REPLY
@stuffy

You can also save your own life that way, as I have a couple of times. Once when I was approaching menopause and my OBGYN announced that at my next visit she would probably put me on the Pill. I said I wouldn't do that without doing some research, since there were cases of blood clots in my mother's family, including my mother. She said, it's only 1 in 10,000, that's very unlikely. I did the research and decided not to take the Pill.
I had a gall bladder removal later from the surgeon who invented the minimally invasive technique (yes, I researched him) and it turned out my GP, who had failed to diagnose the gall bladder issue in the first place, was pooh-poohing my idea that my very painful leg post-surgery might be a clot. The misdiagnosis had meant the surgery was late, and I had gangrene - and every last bit of it had to be scraped out, a difficult thing this surgeon had never done before. The GP did not order an ultrasound and so I started looking up vascular doctors in Best Doctors. I got a referral from an assistant to a doctor who turned out to be researcher - she said there was a great vascular guy at NYU. He sent me immediately for an ultrasound - in a wheelchair - and the scanner inadvertently let out a yelp. She said I had a giant clot in my thigh and he would probably keep me in the hospital. The vascular guy was furious - do you realize you could have died at any point in this journey? I did, actually, which is why I didn't give up and take my doctor's word for it. After a week in the hospital I was released and had to find a new doctor right away. It wasn't until 2000, just after the Genome Project was completed, that I had a knee replacement and got a fully clotted leg after the surgery. My GP hired an outside consultant over the objections of the surgeon, and that man sent off a blood sample to somewhere far away on his hunch I might have a genetic clotting factor - Factor 5, in fact. I probably owe my life to that GP, the one whose patient I became after the first clot.
Science isn't cast in stone, it constantly evolves - and doctors have experience with their own patients and those of their colleagues. Word gets around. You need to be sure you're not inadvertently putting yourself in some unknown danger, so you can't just diagnose yourself and then treat yourself.
The women with the highest cholesterol live the longest, according to a monster review of cholesterol studies cited by Gary Taubes, if that's any comfort.
A lot of doctors ARE independent thinkers but most of them are swamped with work, keeping up with their field - a full-time job - and the requirement to stick to the guidelines for their institutions and they just can't afford that luxury.
You do of course NEED to work with a doctor and there are networks of them, as there are networks of researchers, some of the ones on your list.

Jump to this post

wow. what a story. I have similar. What I say is that I'm lucky to be "rescued" at the perfect time. Because medicine evolves. You kiss a lot of frogs to get to the prince (if you don't die in the process!) and then you help others. High cholesterol might keep some alive (I watched a PBS documentary) but those of us with cardiovascular disease markers - it kills. So low cholesterol it must be for sure.
Yes, gotta to find your "princes (princesses) in the medical world!

REPLY
@lindybowers

to MAYOCONNECTUSER1 I'm a retired health teacher and have studied nutrition since 1978. As for the the podcasts, they are from well educated, experienced doctors. And their information is science based. The doctors have decades and decades of experience in their specialty fields and I trust them. Let's compare that my own doctors at NYU Langone doing absolutely nothing, and who don't even know I have steatosis because they never saw it noted by the radiology Dr who interpreted my lung cat scan. And my doctors only want to look at LIPIDS and tell me to take statins when they are unaware of the whole picture and have no way to address the fat in my liver. They only care about the statistics they plug into the computer telling them my risk factors in 10 years of having a heart attack or stroke. I'm addressing the root cause of the lipids and cholesterol. I don't eat barrels of saturated fat.
I eat a pristine diet of whole foods so was shocked to read on a LUNG CT scan I have steatosis of the liver. I personally thanked the radiologist. I'm doing it my way - Naturally and Slowly. I had a holistic doctor ask for 33 vials of blood and I see him today, Oct. 1 2024, for his analysis of the reports. I have seen the blood test results and have learned how much I didn't even know about my body but it's all making sense. I've studied research papers from medical websites. I understand the reasons why things are going on and ways to correct them. The crashing after eating a meal - even a meal of healthy small portion of poached chicken breast in bone broth, 1/2 cup steamed cauliflower and a salad with no dressing. The INSULIN test was 30.8. and should be 18. I have insulin resistance. So listening to Dr. Eric Berg and his podcasts with reputable doctors on his podcast and by him sending me guides for free on the KETO diet have been appreciated. My own doctor is disappointed that I continue to refuse a statin. She is fear based She has protocols to follow at the University based medical system. Years ago, I've tried Crestor and Lipitor and my legs were in so much pain I had to stop. My doctor doesn't trust that I'll find my way through gentle natural ways which even includes forgiving all the people who have harmed me. Meditation, and being diligent and disciplined every single day. The liver is the seat of "Anger". My neuropathy is very bad so I cannot run but am slowly moving my body and sitting down using hand weights. I'm 5 foot 10. 74 years old. I've gone from 1/1/24 - 207 lbs. down to 10/1/24 - 184. I have 20 more lbs. to go. I consume zero sugar. zero white refined flours and rice. Now I'm phasing into the next stage and after my meeting with the holistic doctor, he'll set me up with the correct exact food plan and supplements - of which I take many, already. Niacin and NAC are faithfully consumed every day. I've dropped 102 points in triglycerides in 2 months. You sound well intended, but a real "Doubting Thomas", just like my Primary Care doctor. I even bought a body composition scale that SHOWS me 12 different measurements inside my body. I'm thoroughly committed in my own recoveries. thank you for replying.

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Have you tried Bio Identical Hormones yet? Probably not I would guess! I bet that will start you on the right path. Sounds like most of your troubles are caused by a lack of hormones. I too studied and have been interested in my body/nutrition since 1970's and seen fads come and go.
1) vitamin D was the key to lowering my AIC and raising my D which brought me out of insulin resistance 15 years ago. ALL WOMEN need this when they are postmenopausal.
2) Try LEVQIO - I LOVE IT. 2x a year to lower/stablize LPa. NO STATINS for ME! It also lowered my cholesterol. My dad took and handled statins well - I experienced the muscle pain/weakness of which you spoke after 3 weeks. The LEVQIO might raise your LPa score in the first year as it loosens the plaque. (mine did and is now 3 points below its start). Don't be too freaked out yet, its all new (the LPa). I have always watched my diet. My dad, cousins all had heart attacks and strokes in their 50s. I am in great condition with 3 clear and one artery 1/3 blocked. Cholesterol down to 187.
I use a mix of Eastern and Western meds and treatments.
My diet is FODMAP related ( IBS)
I take fewer supplements than ever before as my body is now balancing at 67. The hormones are the key - for me. I did the reading and topicals and restarting them at 67 saw an improvement in everything!

REPLY
@stuffy

You can also save your own life that way, as I have a couple of times. Once when I was approaching menopause and my OBGYN announced that at my next visit she would probably put me on the Pill. I said I wouldn't do that without doing some research, since there were cases of blood clots in my mother's family, including my mother. She said, it's only 1 in 10,000, that's very unlikely. I did the research and decided not to take the Pill.
I had a gall bladder removal later from the surgeon who invented the minimally invasive technique (yes, I researched him) and it turned out my GP, who had failed to diagnose the gall bladder issue in the first place, was pooh-poohing my idea that my very painful leg post-surgery might be a clot. The misdiagnosis had meant the surgery was late, and I had gangrene - and every last bit of it had to be scraped out, a difficult thing this surgeon had never done before. The GP did not order an ultrasound and so I started looking up vascular doctors in Best Doctors. I got a referral from an assistant to a doctor who turned out to be researcher - she said there was a great vascular guy at NYU. He sent me immediately for an ultrasound - in a wheelchair - and the scanner inadvertently let out a yelp. She said I had a giant clot in my thigh and he would probably keep me in the hospital. The vascular guy was furious - do you realize you could have died at any point in this journey? I did, actually, which is why I didn't give up and take my doctor's word for it. After a week in the hospital I was released and had to find a new doctor right away. It wasn't until 2000, just after the Genome Project was completed, that I had a knee replacement and got a fully clotted leg after the surgery. My GP hired an outside consultant over the objections of the surgeon, and that man sent off a blood sample to somewhere far away on his hunch I might have a genetic clotting factor - Factor 5, in fact. I probably owe my life to that GP, the one whose patient I became after the first clot.
Science isn't cast in stone, it constantly evolves - and doctors have experience with their own patients and those of their colleagues. Word gets around. You need to be sure you're not inadvertently putting yourself in some unknown danger, so you can't just diagnose yourself and then treat yourself.
The women with the highest cholesterol live the longest, according to a monster review of cholesterol studies cited by Gary Taubes, if that's any comfort.
A lot of doctors ARE independent thinkers but most of them are swamped with work, keeping up with their field - a full-time job - and the requirement to stick to the guidelines for their institutions and they just can't afford that luxury.
You do of course NEED to work with a doctor and there are networks of them, as there are networks of researchers, some of the ones on your list.

Jump to this post

This is a sad but great story!
Thank you for sharing!!

REPLY
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