Vibration and massage therapy

Posted by bulgebattler @bulgebattler, Feb 20, 2019

Are vibration therapy and massages of any benefit against neuropathy?

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@bulgebattler

Just a suggestion for all social media. If using abbreviations please print the full word(s) and then the abbreviation in brackets the first time you use it in a posting. That helps poor duffers like me who are usually struggling and using the dictionary a lot any way. Thanks

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This is a good suggestion, @bulgebattler, to use a full word and then an abbreviation in brackets or parentheses on first mention of a term in posts in discussions like this. We try and follow that practice with our moderation team in communicating with members, so everyone can track with what we are saying as easily as possible.

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@jenniferhunter

@bulgebattler Myofascial release is physical therapy. Doctors have misunderstood living fascia for many years because when they study anatomy it's with cadavers, and they don't see living fascia that can expand. Yoga is a good example of a fascial stretch, but only if you don't stretch to the point of pain. The body will guard and overprotect if you do. Instead, this is gentle, like as if you are going to knead bread dough. You sink in with your hands, push until you find the "barrier" and hold it, and just wait for the tissue to start to slide. After that release, the therapist will change position finding the next path of tight fascia to release. You'll work though layers of this, but it's worth it. Be patient, it takes awhile, and we are all different, but you should start feeling benefits right away. At first, I got itchy skin because so many waste products were released from my dehydrated tissues. I soaked in epsom salt baths to detox which pulls it out through the skin.

I have been doing MFR a few years and doing home self treatments, and just yesterday at my physical therapy appointment, I had a breakthrough session that interconnected so many places we had worked on previously, and I felt pathways go from my neck and jaw, under the collar bone, to my chest, and diaphragm, to my hips and pelvis, my ankles, and all the way up to the base of my skull, and I felt all of it release. That happened in a one hour session, and it felt like as if I was being suspended by a parachute through the air. That's what it can do.

Guess what I can't do now....I've lost some of my ability to cause tingling in my arms because of moving the position of my head. I still feel some, but about 70 % of it is gone now. My head and neck moves better. This means that some of the fascia released around the compressed nerves in-between my collar bone and rib cage. It means that I can move my shoulder blades behind me instead of always winging forward and out to the sides. The tightness on the left side of my chest that has plagued me for years relaxed, and both sides of my chest are moving together equally now when I breathe. I am a cervical spine surgery patient, and also have a bulging lumbar disc. MFR has also released my fascial surgical path scar tissue. MFR kept my neck in better ergonomic position before my spine surgery, and my neck muscles were looser, which made it easier for my surgeon to retract during the procedure, and I had an easier recovery because of it. I didn't get the physical complications that were risks for my surgery. Surgical scar tissue is always a factor to consider in further surgeries in the same area. Tightness and neck spasms move the vertebrae and pull them out of alignment, and even fascial restrictions that crossed through my chest, pulled my thoracic vertebrae out of alignment into a functional scoliosis which my doctor could see on my back. That was corrected with MFR, and now my MRIs show a straight spine.

Don't worry. Just find the best expert level therapist that you can. This really isn't new and the MFR therapy has been around and successful for forty years. Sometimes medicine is slow to embrace change, but many doctors are recommending this for me now, including my surgeon at Mayo.

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Can one effectively do MFR at home? My wife has gone to so many doctors and clinics with no success that going to another doesn't get her attention anymore. I've tried to find spots on her to release but everything feels the same. What should one look for/feel in order to do the MFR procedure?

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@bkruppa

Can one effectively do MFR at home? My wife has gone to so many doctors and clinics with no success that going to another doesn't get her attention anymore. I've tried to find spots on her to release but everything feels the same. What should one look for/feel in order to do the MFR procedure?

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@bkruppa Yes, you can make progress doing MFR at home and you can do it every day if you have the time, or a few days a week. I have done a lot for myself at home that combined with what my physical therapist does helps me progress faster. I have so many layers to work through, and it just takes time. I can't reach everything that my therapist can, but I can add a lot and she tells me where to work. What you may want to try is to contact an expert level MFR therapist who can show you what to do and explain it. My PT explains it by pushing all different directions when you start, and find the direction that has the most ability to move and start with that. The key is to hold the tension against the tissue until it starts to give. When you start. that might take 15 minutes to begin to slide and you have to be patient. Use your body weight to push, not your muscles, so you don't tire out. You have to learn the feel of it in your hands, and the patient can develop body awareness and tell you where they feel it in their body. You can also go to one of the teaching seminars as a couple to learn the techniques. There are a couple of these a year. I sent you a private message with information that I found on the website for myofascialrelease.com.

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@johnbishop

Hi Jim @bulgebattler -- I just went to the website in the post by @jenniferhunter and found a link to locate a MFR therapist.

http://mfrtherapists.com/

I wished I could find one a little closer Rochester but there are quite a few scattered around the Minneapolis area. I think it will benefit me quite a bit from what I've read so far.
John

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Dear John, what would be the first line of tests that we need to do in order to get the exact diagnose and find out why dad’s feet feel like its swallen but its not and seems like he is walking on rocks. We assume that it is due to chemo but we cannot only assume. It seems doctors in Georgia do not have a good understanding how to diagnose the issues. They requested B12 test and tesult is >2000. It seems very high but does it mean that B12 does not get absorbed and it causes neuropathy? I am juat trying to figure out what kind tests he needs to do. Thanks. Ina

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Hello @ina3, I have no medical training or background but expect that the answer to your question is your dad would need to see a neurologist at a major hospital or health provider like Mayo Clinic where a team of specialists can look at the different health symptoms and come up with a diagnosis. Even then it could end up being idiopathic like mine is. This short video by Matthew B Jensen Assistant Professor of Neurology, University of Wisconsin that gives a good explanation of how the different neuropathies are diagnosed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FrQ7Glvgok

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@johnbishop

Hello @ina3, I have no medical training or background but expect that the answer to your question is your dad would need to see a neurologist at a major hospital or health provider like Mayo Clinic where a team of specialists can look at the different health symptoms and come up with a diagnosis. Even then it could end up being idiopathic like mine is. This short video by Matthew B Jensen Assistant Professor of Neurology, University of Wisconsin that gives a good explanation of how the different neuropathies are diagnosed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FrQ7Glvgok

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Thanks John. You are so helpful for me and I surely appreciate it. I have recently seen a physiotherapist who assessed stenosis for pain occurring in my left thigh. She advised that there is no cure for it but I continue to research info on it. This video gives a good grounding for understanding what is going on so much appreciated. I will be following up with her for exercises to strengthen my core muscles as I also have 2 hernias in my stomach area and a couple of herniated discs in the lumbar area. So I want to learn as much as I can on all of this and the video gives a great jumping off point

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@bulgebattler

Thanks John. You are so helpful for me and I surely appreciate it. I have recently seen a physiotherapist who assessed stenosis for pain occurring in my left thigh. She advised that there is no cure for it but I continue to research info on it. This video gives a good grounding for understanding what is going on so much appreciated. I will be following up with her for exercises to strengthen my core muscles as I also have 2 hernias in my stomach area and a couple of herniated discs in the lumbar area. So I want to learn as much as I can on all of this and the video gives a great jumping off point

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Glad to help @bulgebattler! There is another discussion here on Connect that you may be interested in joining.

> Groups > Neuropathy > Myofascial Release Therapy (MFR) for treating compression and pain
-- https://connect.mayoclinic.org/discussion/myofascial-release-therapy-mfr-for-treating-compression-and-pain/

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I find myself massaging my toes and feet every time I have a free moment, just to make sure that they are still there. I know this is good for my hands as well, since I have polyneuropathy. But I’d love to find something not terribly expensive that would work to stimulate my mostly numb toes and feet.

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Hi @stefspad Back in the seventies we bought a thing called (at the time) a "footsie roller", and I see something similar on Amazon now. Basically it has firm grooves and you roll it under your feet and toes. Take a look: https://smile.amazon.com/Wooden-Roller-Body-Back-Company/dp/B000KK2RJC/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=footsie+roller&qid=1598551004&sr=8-5

There is also a thing my wife used to put between her toes for her PN. I could not find the exact same thing but here is something similar from Amazon:
https://smile.amazon.com/Pedi-Soother-Solutions-Arch-Support/dp/B07CQP6Z3F/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=toe+spreader+for+neuropathy&qid=1598551219&sr=8-5
Maybe someone else knows how to find the other thing for putting between the toes that might be better. That's all I've got, hope it may help. Best, Hank

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@stefspad

I find myself massaging my toes and feet every time I have a free moment, just to make sure that they are still there. I know this is good for my hands as well, since I have polyneuropathy. But I’d love to find something not terribly expensive that would work to stimulate my mostly numb toes and feet.

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Hi @stefspad, You will notice we have merged your discussion with a similar discussion on Vibration and massage therapy in the Neuropathy Group. I see that you have already met Hank @jesfactsmon and he has offered some suggestions. Early on when I was looking for something to help my neuropathy I bought a small hand held massager made by Wahl and while it made my feet feel better for a few minutes it didn't really help my neuropathy. Here is the one I tried for less than $30 - https://www.amazon.com/Wahl-Therapy-Therapeutic-Massager-4196-1201/dp/B00YMRTDF0/ref=sr_1_8

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