Intractable Pain (IP) Doctors

Posted by cwallen9 @cwallen9, Jul 21, 2019

I just found a guidebook by Dr. Forest Tennant that talks about "Intractable Pain (IP)". Instead of chronic pain, he deals with patients that have unbearable pain every day. He treats it differently than chronic pain. Basically, he believes that opioids are necessary for people with IP. He also has some good advice for dealing with it. Does anyone know where one can find doctors that are IP doctors? I live in central Pennsylvania and there are none around us. I have been dealing with severe, unbearable neurapathy pain for a year, and none of the usual pain meds help (gabapentin, Elavil, Ultram, etc.). The website is at http://www.foresttennant.com. There is a guide in the "self help" tab. I attached the guide.

Shared files

IntractablePainSurvival Dr Tennant (IntractablePainSurvival-Dr-Tennant.pdf)

Now I do not know if this is true or not, but my Neurologist said that opiods do not work for Neuropathy. I too, have foot neuropathy. I would say it was utterly intractable. I finally had Calmare/Scrambler therapy, and it has provided some relief. But the pain of neuropathy is excruciating. Unimaginable. I will look at everything you sent. I am always trying to learn and research what can be done. You might also want to try a product called Kratom. It is from a plant. It is for relaxing and pain, although no claims are made about pain on the site I get it from. Look up Happy Hippo, and try some Kratom. Try a slow strain of their product. This is the type that helps with pain and relaxation. Happy Hippo is a very reputable company. Good luck with your pain. Lori Renee

REPLY

I had to send a special thank you for this awesome book about pain. I am a voracious reader in trying to find what may help. God Bless you. I have never seen such an extensive pain book. Lori Renee

REPLY

@cwallen — Thank you for starting this discussion. I think there are a lot of members who may find it helpful to connect with each other. Here are a few links I found but maybe you have already seen them.

Alliance for the Treatment of Intractable Pain
http://face-facts.org/atip/

Intractable or chronic pain — there is a difference
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1071146/

REPLY

Thank You for some hopeful new approach. My pain is so intense I am amazed my feet are not just bursting into flames. I will ask my pain and neurologist about IP.
Bless all of you who suffer I value each of you who help me not to feel so alone,

REPLY
@notborntoburn

Thank You for some hopeful new approach. My pain is so intense I am amazed my feet are not just bursting into flames. I will ask my pain and neurologist about IP.
Bless all of you who suffer I value each of you who help me not to feel so alone,

Jump to this post

I can relate to feet bursting into flames. This is one horrid illness. I put my feet into a cold bath when it happens. When I get out, the burning is there. Also, my neurologist says that opiods do not do much for neuropathy. So the main treatment of opiods in the IP book is not really acknowledged by neurologists. However, I am now curious again if maybe opiods do work. Opiods are such a touchy subject, because they are so badly abused, so sometimes I think neurologists do not want to prescribe them. I am thinking of talking to my pharmacist about opiods in the treatment of neuropathy. May get a more impartial response from a pharmacist, because he cannot write prescriptions. Meanwhile, we suffer. Take care, and try to fight this fight as best you can. Find things to bring joy, without too many calories!!!! Lori Renee

REPLY
@johnbishop

@cwallen — Thank you for starting this discussion. I think there are a lot of members who may find it helpful to connect with each other. Here are a few links I found but maybe you have already seen them.

Alliance for the Treatment of Intractable Pain
http://face-facts.org/atip/

Intractable or chronic pain — there is a difference
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1071146/

Jump to this post

John, you are always so helpful. God bless! You are always right on the money!!!! Lori Renee

REPLY
@lorirenee1

Now I do not know if this is true or not, but my Neurologist said that opiods do not work for Neuropathy. I too, have foot neuropathy. I would say it was utterly intractable. I finally had Calmare/Scrambler therapy, and it has provided some relief. But the pain of neuropathy is excruciating. Unimaginable. I will look at everything you sent. I am always trying to learn and research what can be done. You might also want to try a product called Kratom. It is from a plant. It is for relaxing and pain, although no claims are made about pain on the site I get it from. Look up Happy Hippo, and try some Kratom. Try a slow strain of their product. This is the type that helps with pain and relaxation. Happy Hippo is a very reputable company. Good luck with your pain. Lori Renee

Jump to this post

Have you much luck with Kratom? I have heard good and bad things about it.

REPLY
@lorirenee1

I had to send a special thank you for this awesome book about pain. I am a voracious reader in trying to find what may help. God Bless you. I have never seen such an extensive pain book. Lori Renee

Jump to this post

No problem. I just obtained this and thought that this doctor really understands the pain that we all are going through. I wish he was near me.

REPLY
@cwallen9

Have you much luck with Kratom? I have heard good and bad things about it.

Jump to this post

I do think that Kratom is good, but you have to experiment with different strains and amounts. I have found the Happy Hippo company, and the slow strains are the best to destress from pain and actually help the pain itself. I have found that about a teaspoon of the powdered Kratom into about two ounces of water is the right amount, but I have used somewhat more at times. I mix the Kratom into the water, and just chug it down in one nasty gulp. The stuff does not taste good. In about ten minutes, or maybe less, I get very relaxed without feeling drugged. I just feel good. As far as the pain, it has gone away when I use the stuff. Unfortunately, it only lasts about an hour, to an hour and a half or so. But often when it wears off, the pain is gone. I think I prefer it to CBD drops, but I do take them too. Check out the Happy Hippo company on line, slow strains for relaxation and pain. They are a darn good company with fresh product. Shipping is fast, and they give Kratom samples. I actually really liked one of the samples. Give the stuff a try. Get past the yucky flavor, gulp it down, and feel better. Best on an empty stomach. Effects are best this way. Good luck, pain warrior. No fun at all. Lori Renee

REPLY

With the mention of kratom in this discussion, I'd like to post this important note from a Mayo Clinic pharmacist:

Kratom is a natural product but it does have significant risks and side effects. Because of these risks the FDA banned import of Kratom in August 2016 and issued a notice of intent to classify 2 chemicals in Kratom as Schedule 1 drugs (the same category as heroin). There are no FDA-approved uses for kratom, and the agency has received concerning reports about the safety of kratom. FDA is actively evaluating all available scientific information on this issue. (2019) https://www.fda.gov/news-events/public-health-focus/fda-and-kratom

Kratom can cause dependence and withdrawl symptoms including aggression, anxiety and other negative psychiatric effects, muscle aches, spasms, tremors, insomnia, fever and upset stomach. It can also cause dangerous slowed breathing and seizures. It can worsen psychiatric disease and may increase the risk of suicide. Kratom can impair liver function. Kratom interacts with other herbal medications including Jimson Weed. It interacts with sedating medications. It has the potential for many other drug interactions because of the way it is metabolized.

For more information see:
– National Institute of Health: Drug Facts, Kratom https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/kratom
– Center for Disease Control https://www.webmd.com/mental-health/addiction/news/20190411/cdc-americans-are-dying-from-kratom-overdoses#1

REPLY

Thanks, Colleen. I had no idea that Kratom has all these problems. I will be reading everything you attached. Sometimes my pain is too bad to just rely on Gabapentin. I only take Kratom about once or twice a week, tops, and so far, do not get any addictive cravings, side effects, or mood problems. But I still need to know what I am doing!!!!! So thank you so much. Pain is a monster, and I am always on a quest to feel better. I have even done Scrambler therapy, but the positive effects are beginning to lessen. Time for booster treatments, but so damn expensive. Thanks again for your work in posting all of this. I want to be informed. Do not need to have more problems!!!!!! Lori Renee

REPLY

My personal experience is opioids is the only thing that reduces my pain which is very severe and seemingly intractable. Even then, they don't fully eliminate and they come with side effects. On the other side of things, antidepressants and anticonvulsants didn't help at all and produced side effects. By the way 'Ultram' is an opioid. Just less potent than oxycodone etc.

REPLY
@colleenyoung

With the mention of kratom in this discussion, I'd like to post this important note from a Mayo Clinic pharmacist:

Kratom is a natural product but it does have significant risks and side effects. Because of these risks the FDA banned import of Kratom in August 2016 and issued a notice of intent to classify 2 chemicals in Kratom as Schedule 1 drugs (the same category as heroin). There are no FDA-approved uses for kratom, and the agency has received concerning reports about the safety of kratom. FDA is actively evaluating all available scientific information on this issue. (2019) https://www.fda.gov/news-events/public-health-focus/fda-and-kratom

Kratom can cause dependence and withdrawl symptoms including aggression, anxiety and other negative psychiatric effects, muscle aches, spasms, tremors, insomnia, fever and upset stomach. It can also cause dangerous slowed breathing and seizures. It can worsen psychiatric disease and may increase the risk of suicide. Kratom can impair liver function. Kratom interacts with other herbal medications including Jimson Weed. It interacts with sedating medications. It has the potential for many other drug interactions because of the way it is metabolized.

For more information see:
– National Institute of Health: Drug Facts, Kratom https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/kratom
– Center for Disease Control https://www.webmd.com/mental-health/addiction/news/20190411/cdc-americans-are-dying-from-kratom-overdoses#1

Jump to this post

For those of us with pain, there is no help. After reading 60 some posts, I never read one that mentioned if anyone has gone to the Mayo Clinic seeking help. My husband and I went to Mayo Clinic in Scottsdale, AZ. for years until we moved too far away and unable to travel that far. I love Mayo and all the doctors there. I had my knee replacements there 20 years ago and still no problems. I can’t help but wonder what Mayo has to offer. There are people with worse problems than us with pain issues but many with pain are young and could be productive in so many ways if not for pain.
Arlene

REPLY

I was diagnosed by my GP about 6 years ago and after he ran out of options he tried to refer me to Mayo in Rochester. I was turned down with a short trite note that they were unable to see where they could be of any benefit over what my family doctor had tried. Found that a little disturbing that my local doctor in a town of 7500 had the knowledge and resources of Mayo clinic but after talking with him again was told that idiopathic nerve issues are a needle in a haystack and Mayo would rather look at cases that are not quite so shot in the dark. His comment was, if the could perform surgery on you with a good chance of an outcome that would be good advertising you'd be in quickly. Good luck, I've not found any reliable relief for the burning and rocks in my shoes feeling and I look at everything new all the time.

REPLY
@arlenejc

For those of us with pain, there is no help. After reading 60 some posts, I never read one that mentioned if anyone has gone to the Mayo Clinic seeking help. My husband and I went to Mayo Clinic in Scottsdale, AZ. for years until we moved too far away and unable to travel that far. I love Mayo and all the doctors there. I had my knee replacements there 20 years ago and still no problems. I can’t help but wonder what Mayo has to offer. There are people with worse problems than us with pain issues but many with pain are young and could be productive in so many ways if not for pain.
Arlene

Jump to this post

I tried but unfortunately Mayo in MN turned me down after already being diagnosed with Small Fiber Poly Neuropathy. It is what it is.

REPLY
Please login or register to post a reply.