Cannot die in hospital even if you beg to.

Posted by slkanowitz @slkanowitz, May 11 6:37am

I recently went to hospital by ambulance because of intractable 10 level pain and I have had so many severe illnesses I had just had it with life and wanted to die. I’m DNR status. I begged everyone to let me go but they wouldn’t and ended up overdosing me on opioids for the pain to point I saw the tunnel of light but couldn’t go through it. They reversed the opioids with Narcan. The hospital staff determined my destiny and here I am. It’s their job to keep everyone alive no matter what you want or how terrible your quality of life will be. I guess my work here on earth is not done yet. Just consider this information if you’re ever in this situation as you will have no control of your fate in a hospital. I have seen this happen to others and it is sad we can’t make these choices for ourselves. Who knows what outcome is best. Perhaps God? Just want to plant seeds for thought for anyone in a similar situation.

Interested in more discussions like this? Go to the Aging Well Support Group.

@kayraymat

I would think that if a person had a DNR, that makes their wishes known ahead of time.

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@kayraymat my understanding of a DNR - Do Not Resuscitate - means do not resuscitate in the event of a heart attack. I don’t think letting someone die without food or water, or without tube feeding, comes under a DNR directive from a patient. Starving a person to death seems inhumane to me and even if a person refuses to eat for whatever reason (difficulty swallowing being one, in which case the patient should be tube fed).

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@rashida

@kayraymat my understanding of a DNR - Do Not Resuscitate - means do not resuscitate in the event of a heart attack. I don’t think letting someone die without food or water, or without tube feeding, comes under a DNR directive from a patient. Starving a person to death seems inhumane to me and even if a person refuses to eat for whatever reason (difficulty swallowing being one, in which case the patient should be tube fed).

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If a terminally ill person chooses to die by refusing food and water that is their choice. A feeding tube would be abusive. If you are a hospice patient a feeding tube is not allowed. It is considered curative and that is not the mission of hospice.

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@rashida

@kayraymat my understanding of a DNR - Do Not Resuscitate - means do not resuscitate in the event of a heart attack. I don’t think letting someone die without food or water, or without tube feeding, comes under a DNR directive from a patient. Starving a person to death seems inhumane to me and even if a person refuses to eat for whatever reason (difficulty swallowing being one, in which case the patient should be tube fed).

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Even if they don't want the tube?

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@kayraymat

Even if they don't want the tube?

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I'm responding here to concerns about eating/drinking and more in hospital settings. Many problems can be avoided by having someone ambulatory--friend or family--be with the patient. Consent needs to be given for procedures, so if the patient is unable to communicate it is good to have someone there with medical power of attorney. My advice for someone who is completely on their own in a hospital is to get support from hospital clergy and/or social worker. They really can help. Consent can be a gray zone in an emergency, and many situations are far from perfect. My experience has taught me that non-medical support is often needed by the patient. A person can also ask to be discharged from a hospital to hospice. These are difficult subjects--and I'm glad those of you commenting have the courage to examine them!

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@kayraymat

Even if they don't want the tube?

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@kayraymat some patients are in a state where they are not aware of what’s going on, and fight tubes and intravenous lines. In this case intervention is necessary, but if the patient has made a written decision for DNR that includes “no extraordinary measures”, intubating that person would fall under the “DNR” category. It’s usually people who are well into their eighties and beyond, who would add a written “no extraordinary measures” clause to the DNR. I am not an expert, however - it is just what I understand about DNR.

What I mean is, people requesting a DNR should be very specific about what they want before they are in a state where they cannot articulate it. In other words, make up a Living Will. Here’s what I found when I Googled that:
https://www.rvlaw.ca/living-wills-questions-and-answers/

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@gravity3

If a terminally ill person chooses to die by refusing food and water that is their choice. A feeding tube would be abusive. If you are a hospice patient a feeding tube is not allowed. It is considered curative and that is not the mission of hospice.

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@gravity3 so … they expect the patient to starve to death …?

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@rashida

@gravity3 so … they expect the patient to starve to death …?

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Are you referring to hospice? If so, hospice is end of life care meaning that hospice does not provide curative procedures. If a hospice patient decides they want to pursue something curative they need to leave the care of hospice but can come back to hospice care later as long as they still meet the admission criteria.

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This conversation has gotten too painful for me. I am sorry. Once I was critically I'll no hope. I was coded. I cannot provide anymore comments.

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Did you have DNR filed at the hospital and/or note in wallet or executor of the Advance Care Directive? You need the directive in place.

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@rashida

@kayraymat some patients are in a state where they are not aware of what’s going on, and fight tubes and intravenous lines. In this case intervention is necessary, but if the patient has made a written decision for DNR that includes “no extraordinary measures”, intubating that person would fall under the “DNR” category. It’s usually people who are well into their eighties and beyond, who would add a written “no extraordinary measures” clause to the DNR. I am not an expert, however - it is just what I understand about DNR.

What I mean is, people requesting a DNR should be very specific about what they want before they are in a state where they cannot articulate it. In other words, make up a Living Will. Here’s what I found when I Googled that:
https://www.rvlaw.ca/living-wills-questions-and-answers/

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It's my understanding that an Advance Care Directive is also required.

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