Recent diagnosis: Have questions about treatment options?

Posted by mrajat @mrajat, Nov 30 10:11am

I am getting diagnosed with pancreatic cancer after an abdominal CT last week. I’m 45 male, South Asian, and married with 8yo twins. I have a healthy lifestyle, run half marathons, and have no family history of cancer among my parents, grandparents or uncles/aunts. I’m still in denial. I started having back pain 1.5 months and abdomen pain 1 month back. The doctor prescribed an abdomen CT scan which found a mass on the pancreatic head 27mm * 24mm. By the time the diagnosis came out, I also developed jaundice (4.9 total bilirubin) although my bilirubin levels have always been elevated (in the range of 1.5 and 3 going back 11 years). They did an ERCP procedure to put in a stent in the bile duct and biopsy the mass. The biopsy results came back inconclusive.
The cancer marker (CA 19-9) measured 153 as of last week. So far, all doctors have said it’s cancer and most likely pancreatic cancer. It seems locally advanced from the CT and MRI. I’m shocked by the grim cure rate / survival rate.
I have seen two surgeons so far. The first surgeon at Univ of Pennsylvania says it’s borderline resectable —so he wants me to get up to 6 months of chemo before attempting surgery / Whipple procedure. The second surgeon at MSK (Memorial Sloan Kettering) ordered a repeat CT scan with focus on pancreas after which he feels comfortable that he can remove it right away and is asking me to go for surgery first.
I have a few questions and would really appreciate your help:
- Could this be anything else?
- Which approach sounds better for overall survival as well as short-term survival: Chemo first then surgery (U Penn) or surgery first (MSK)?
- MSK surgeon has given me surgery appointment for 3 weeks out which is his earliest available. Do you think it’s too risky to wait that long?
Thanks!

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@colleenyoung

@mrajat, I thought I would check in. How are you doing with your treatment decisions?

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Hi Colleen - I decided to go with Adjuvant (surgery first). I am scheduled in about a week. I am also hoping to enroll in a vaccine trial.

Do folks have any recommendation for vaccine trials? I hope I don't get assigned to the "Control" group. Have to figure out how that works.

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@carrie40

I did start the chemo BEFORE the Whipple, as recommended and had to stop as I was practically comatose. Yes, I disregarded (hard to say I "went against" because I know my oncologist was sincere and had spent many years trying to make his patients well) his recommendation. I would say the oncologist supported my decision, though disagreed with it and said radiation was palliative, not a cure. Also, I had great support from my son and daughter who saw what the chemo did and wanted me to have as good a life as possible in my later years. I still see the oncologist every 3 months and he persists in suggesting chemo at every meeting, but accepts my decision.
I did not have radiation until a mass appeared in my mesentery, over a year after the Whipple. I found out then how much less radiation impacted my body. I now see both the oncologist (the chemo expert) and the radiologist every 3 months.

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Hi Carrie! Seems like radiation has worked for you so far. Do you monitor your CA19-9 levels and has it been under control?

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@ashley2235

I was diagnosed in August 2022 and had total pancreatectomy with major vascular reconstruction at Mayo in July 2023. I am currently doing very well and had clear scans just last week at Mayo.

In regards to chemo, I was saying that I would absolutely advocate for chemotherapy both before and after surgery. Even if found to have clear margins during surgery. In my opinion, the more chemo the better. And chemo after surgery can help prevent recurrence by killing off micrometastasis.

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Ah I see. But you don't think the ill effects of keeping tumor in there might outweigh the downside of delaying chemo by 2 months?
I got repeat blood work and my CA19-9 increased from 153 to 177 in 11 days, so that makes me think the tumor isn't as aggressive as what I have heard in some other cases.

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@mrajat

Ah I see. But you don't think the ill effects of keeping tumor in there might outweigh the downside of delaying chemo by 2 months?
I got repeat blood work and my CA19-9 increased from 153 to 177 in 11 days, so that makes me think the tumor isn't as aggressive as what I have heard in some other cases.

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Oh ok. Forgot you said you were able to have surgery very quickly at MSK. In that case I would do surgery then chemo after. It's a tough decision. I would get multiple recommendations and move rapidly either way.

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@mrajat

Hi Carrie! Seems like radiation has worked for you so far. Do you monitor your CA19-9 levels and has it been under control?

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Hi Mrajat,
My CA19-9 only gets monitored every 3 months. No, it's not under control completely; in June this year 2024 it was 102; in August, 61 after the radiation in July; in November, 61. Waiting for February. The highest I ever had before the Whipple was 153, which seems mild compared to others I read. Thanks for asking, Carrie

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@markymarkfl

Some other random thoughts:

1) In the time you have between now and surgery (or chemo if you go that route), try to get all the relevant genetic tests possible done: at least a germline test like Invitae to determine any inherited mutations you may have.

2) It might not hurt to get a somatic blood test like Guardant 360 for genetic mutations of cancer cells floating around in your blood.

3) If you go with surgery first, ask your surgeon ASAP (because this stuff takes time to resolve) his/her process for saving tumor tissue and having some of it stored locally or sent out for NGS (Next-generation Sequencing).
a) NGS options include tests from companies like Tempus
b) "Live-state" tumor storage from companies like https://storemytumor.com/
c) Sensitivity testing from a company like https://www.travera.com/
d) ctDNA tests like Signatera for MRD (Microscopic Residual Disease); useful for ongoing assessment of treatment effectiveness or (supporting) indication of recurrence.

Travera had a free clinical trial going on last summer for testing pancreatic tissue. Since you may not know before surgery or before adjuvant chemo begins which drugs are most effective on your cancer, using the recovery time after surgery to get sensitivity tests done might help your docs start you on the best chemo first.

(e.g., even though Folfirinox is the regimen of choice for young, fit patients like you, it might not be the best. In my case, Gemcitabine + Abraxane + Cisplatin after the recurrence turned out to be way more effective. Had we switched to that part way through my neoadjuvant treatment, my outcome might have been very different.)

Regarding adjuvant therapy: If you go straight to surgery without any prior (neoadjuvant) chemo, after surgery you will still be a "chemo virgin" ("treatment naive" is the medical term, iirc). This might qualify you for certain clinical trials, including "vaccine" trials that you might not otherwise be eligible for. MSKCC always has a ton of trials going on, but every trial is time-consuming and tricky to get into. Ask about those options at your first opportunity.

Try to get at least one more CA19-9 test as a baseline before you begin treatment (surgery or chemo). Get the tests again after surgery as well, ideally at biweekly intervals. You might see inflated numbers shortly after surgery (due to inflammation, etc), but you should eventually see a downward trend, and eventually (ideally) numbers in the low/normal range. Don't stop there -- that should be your new, post-op baseline, which serves as the reference for successive tests to see if you ever start trending upward.

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Hi Mark! Do you know if the three tests you recommended (NGS, sensitivity test and ctDNA) are done on the actual tumor or on a small sample of it?
I had my presurgical visit today. The surgeon said they can do these, but I didn't get a lot of time to go into the details. Then later the research team said that they send the entire tumor for vaccine development. So I have to circle back and figure out how it's all going to pan out.
I also learnt that they hold out a control group that will not receive the vaccine and I am not too thrilled about the possibility of falling into the control group 🙁
Let me know if you have any suggestions.

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I would strongly advocate for chemo after surgery or a well documented clinical trial. I too had clear margins and lymph nodes but it did read its head again.
So very glad I did chemo afterwards and continued into a clinical trial before my chemo was exhausted.

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@gamaryanne

I would strongly advocate for chemo after surgery or a well documented clinical trial. I too had clear margins and lymph nodes but it did read its head again.
So very glad I did chemo afterwards and continued into a clinical trial before my chemo was exhausted.

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Hi Mary! What clinical trial did you get in? Was it Phase 1 or Phase 2? The vaccine trial at MSK is currently in Phase 2 and there is a 33% control sample (no vaccine). Trying to see if there is a sureshot way to get the vaccine.
Thanks!

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I am in a phase 1b trial. My cancer was too far advanced for vaccine. Although, if this trial has me declared NED I certainly would hope for the vaccine at phase 3. I’m not quite there yet

Have your surgery, hope for clear margins, and then make your decisions. You won’t be able to do anything for a bit post surgery while your body recovers. God’s blessings to you! Stay strong!!

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Hello,
I got the CT Scan diagnosed as Pancreatic Cancer in Aug 2024. Immediately went to MSK in Westchester to get another scan. My surgeon at MSK is Dr Soares and he suggested 3 months of chemo first and then Whipple.
I just finished the chemo and after another scan my cancer has shrunk from 1.1mm to just .4mm. I am scheduled to meet with Dr. Soares in a week to see what are the next steps. I hope surgery followed by 3 more months of chemo. Good luck with your decision about what your next steps are as this whole journey is scary!

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