Garlic for MAC-Lung -Not replacement for treatment but additional

Posted by meadows @meadows, Oct 23, 2023

I've heard garlic can help tone down Mac-Lung in addition to other treatments. On the other hand, garlic is not good for GERD which can be related. Has anyone noticed improvements with garlic? (I am not suggesting, at all, that garlic be used as a sole treatment.) Thanks

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GREAT question - Reports of the benefits of garlic are everywhere. It has been used for a very long time in herbal and folk medicine. And there is truth there.
But hard research studies, including vehicles for delivery of the benefits to the lungs and dosage, are missing in every case.
Here are some articles to dive into for a better understanding, some are easier reading than the others.
This has a great graphic showing the benefits of allicin in the body:
https://www.scientificarchives.com/article/allicin-as-an-adjunct-immunotherapy-against-tuberculosis
And one with an interesting explanation of how they built a model lung to test allicin:
https://www.spandidos-publications.com/10.3892/etm.2019.8387?text=fulltext
Finally -
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8001868/
It unfortunately they reported "Allicin taken up by cells, or entering the bloodstream, reacts readily with GSH in competition with cysteine residues in proteins. For this reason, it is difficult to envisage being able to achieve a therapeutically relevant concentration of allicin in cells anywhere in the body by simply swallowing it. Furthermore, as mentioned in the introduction, allicin is an irritant which stimulates pain-sensing neurons, and self-medication has led to a spate of reports of self-inflicted harm."

So, Monday light reading for your entertainment.
My takeaway -
Inhaling garlic vapors may help by boosting antibiotic effectiveness, reducing their side effects and potentially having antimicrobial and anti-inflammatory actions.
Eating garlic, not so much - the helpful compounds are broken down by the body before the allicin reaches the lungs
Research is underway to develop a proper method of delivery and dosage.

Let's invite further evidence-based comments to our party!
Sue

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Skin absorption is possible but be very cautious and incremental as very serious skin chemical burns are a real possibility. I have become a bit of an expert in the matter over the last few months trying this on myself. I will attempt to post on my efforts later but in the meantime if you try it GO SLOWLY

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@bradzepfan

Skin absorption is possible but be very cautious and incremental as very serious skin chemical burns are a real possibility. I have become a bit of an expert in the matter over the last few months trying this on myself. I will attempt to post on my efforts later but in the meantime if you try it GO SLOWLY

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Are you using allicin/garlic topically or as a vapor?
I haven't found any papers about topical application having an antibacterial effect on the lungs, have you?
I saw in another post that you were trying to avoid the allicin passing through the liver, but topical application goes to the blood vessels, then to the circulatory system, which passes through the liver, before it would get to your lungs, right?
Sue

REPLY
@sueinmn

GREAT question - Reports of the benefits of garlic are everywhere. It has been used for a very long time in herbal and folk medicine. And there is truth there.
But hard research studies, including vehicles for delivery of the benefits to the lungs and dosage, are missing in every case.
Here are some articles to dive into for a better understanding, some are easier reading than the others.
This has a great graphic showing the benefits of allicin in the body:
https://www.scientificarchives.com/article/allicin-as-an-adjunct-immunotherapy-against-tuberculosis
And one with an interesting explanation of how they built a model lung to test allicin:
https://www.spandidos-publications.com/10.3892/etm.2019.8387?text=fulltext
Finally -
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8001868/
It unfortunately they reported "Allicin taken up by cells, or entering the bloodstream, reacts readily with GSH in competition with cysteine residues in proteins. For this reason, it is difficult to envisage being able to achieve a therapeutically relevant concentration of allicin in cells anywhere in the body by simply swallowing it. Furthermore, as mentioned in the introduction, allicin is an irritant which stimulates pain-sensing neurons, and self-medication has led to a spate of reports of self-inflicted harm."

So, Monday light reading for your entertainment.
My takeaway -
Inhaling garlic vapors may help by boosting antibiotic effectiveness, reducing their side effects and potentially having antimicrobial and anti-inflammatory actions.
Eating garlic, not so much - the helpful compounds are broken down by the body before the allicin reaches the lungs
Research is underway to develop a proper method of delivery and dosage.

Let's invite further evidence-based comments to our party!
Sue

Jump to this post

Will Inhaling garlic vapors help? This is very interesting. Thank you Sue.

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I doubt that the vapors would help,but it is an interestimg thought for perhaps some relief. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Patty

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@meadows

I doubt that the vapors would help,but it is an interestimg thought for perhaps some relief. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Patty

Jump to this post

Hi Patty - actually, inhaling the vapors is exactly what they are testing, in conjunction with using antibiotics. There are all kinds of folk remedies that have you lean over a steaming pot with garlic in it and a towel over your head...you get the idea. There again - how much are you getting, how long do you steam, and is the steam causing conversion of any substances from helpful to harmful, etc.
The dilemma at this point is to figure out how to get a precisely measured amount of allicin into a stable suspension in a solution that can be inhaled or nebulized (without damaging delicate tissues.)
I'm waiting for the researchers to figure this out - I have enough problems without taking a risk of further damaging my lungs.
Sue

REPLY
@sueinmn

Are you using allicin/garlic topically or as a vapor?
I haven't found any papers about topical application having an antibacterial effect on the lungs, have you?
I saw in another post that you were trying to avoid the allicin passing through the liver, but topical application goes to the blood vessels, then to the circulatory system, which passes through the liver, before it would get to your lungs, right?
Sue

Jump to this post

topically. the allicin would first enter the veinous system, then into the lungs, then eventually spread among the general arterial system. i have not seen any main stream papers on it, though topical oils in general have been used in "alternative medicine" for ages. this would be a way to avoid liver "first pass" metabolism.

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@sueinmn

Hi Patty - actually, inhaling the vapors is exactly what they are testing, in conjunction with using antibiotics. There are all kinds of folk remedies that have you lean over a steaming pot with garlic in it and a towel over your head...you get the idea. There again - how much are you getting, how long do you steam, and is the steam causing conversion of any substances from helpful to harmful, etc.
The dilemma at this point is to figure out how to get a precisely measured amount of allicin into a stable suspension in a solution that can be inhaled or nebulized (without damaging delicate tissues.)
I'm waiting for the researchers to figure this out - I have enough problems without taking a risk of further damaging my lungs.
Sue

Jump to this post

do you know where they are studying the vapor/inhalation method?

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@bradzepfan

do you know where they are studying the vapor/inhalation method?

Jump to this post

I posted a bunch of references above, but I think it is this one:
https://www.spandidos-publications.com/10.3892/etm.2019.8387?text=fulltext

Otherwise you would need to read through all of them them (and possibly even some of the cited papers) to find the specifics.
Sue

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vapors of garlic are nearly equally toxic to bacteria and lung tissue, this may be improved by good enough levels of glutathione (can this be increased in lung tissue?)

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29023413/

“the sensitivity of rat precision-cut lung slices (PCLS) to allicin was decreased by raising the [GSH] to the approximate blood plasma level of 1 mM”

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