Lupus or not Lupus?

Posted by toomanyoars @toomanyoars, Oct 25, 2018

8 years with either wild goose chases, no tests and it's stress or tons of expensive tests and we don't know. Consistently they look for Lupus. I had 3 years of ANA positive results then switched doctors (insurance reasons) to end up with a new doc and new labs that show ANA negitive every time. So then obviously no lupus, right? Now 7 months of fever...still ANA negitive they think maybe lupus was the right diagnosis but until it shows positive they run more tests. Epstein Barr, Cytomegalovirus, Thyroid panels, etc. I have a fibromyalgia diagnosis but so many other symptoms don't fit so I am in a constant loop and feeling worse every day and more frustrated. I am not sure what to do next. Another doc, another lab, give up and quit trying to find out why I am so sick?

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@thecyborgenchi

I had 28 tests done. I'll list them as I see on the paperwork, many apologies - it's lengthy 😀 I will also put the results of any of them that showed up as anything other than normal in parenthesis. I was never tested for Covid when I believe I had it, but that is included in the blood work below. Side note: I don't know if I'm allowed to throw this info out there, but at this point I don't mind that people see my info, so... *shrug*

TSH, serum or plasma
CBC w/auto diff (of the 20 parts of this: platelet count was high)
T3, free, serum or plasma
T4, total, serum
vitamin B12, quant, blood
SARS CoV 2 IgG Ab, QN IA, serum or plasma (1 part: high - confirms I had Covid, if I'm not mistaken)
estradiol, serum
progesterone, serum
dhea-sulfate, serum
testosterone, total, serum
Ih + FSH, serum
lipid panel, blood (of the 16 parts: HDL cholesterol low, LDL particle number high, LDL small high, LDL medium high, LDL peak size low, hs CRP high)
HbA1c (hemoglobin, A1c), blood
insulin, serum
C-peptide, serum
CMP, serum or plasma (of the 18 parts: urea nitrogen [BUN] low)
urinalysis, dipstick
CK (creatine kinase), total, serum
magnesium, serum or plasma
vitamin D, 25-hydroxy, total, serum (1 part: low at 23 - but I knew this already)
iron + TIBC + ferritin, serum
uric acid, serum or plasma
erythrocyte sedimentation rate by westergren method
ANA (antinuclear antibodies) panel, serum (of the 3 parts: ANA screen - ifa positive/abnormal, ANA titer - 1:40 high, ANA pattern - nuclear, speckled/abnormal)
rheumatoid factor, qualitative, serum
CRP, high sensitivity, serum or plasma
anti-C1Q Ab, serum
systemic lupus erythematosus profile
lupus anticoagulant, plasma (of the 4 parts: anticoagulant not detected, drvvt screen high by 1 point)

And there you have it. Again, I'm not a professional by any means, but I like to think that I am intelligent enough to understand things, especially when I do the research that explains what it means. I've looked up the results of every one of these and the one that worries me the most is the ANA panel - it does NOT say normal, soooo... ?! According to what I've read, those results are indicative of lupus, if nothing else, further testing. I just called my doctor's office (they never answer) and left a message, telling them I want a referral to a rheumatologist, and provided the name and location of the one I chose that my insurance covers. She is 2 hours away, but I expected that.

Thank you for responding, by the way. I am finding that the support I'm receiving here is helping tremendously. I start crying every time I see someone has responded with kind words, encouragement, resources... it doesn't matter. My feelings of "I must be insane" start to go away, and that's important to me. I'm NOT crazy (not in this regard anyway lol). I'm NOT imagining these symptoms. My quality of life has tanked and I just want answers and some goals to work toward getting better, you know?

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Precious One, You are not crazy. Stress is real with health issues....especially when you can't get a diagnosis. Praying much. Keep me posted please.

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@thisoldewe

Nope... you're not crazy, just stressed!
You are experiencing the same thing that many of us have
also lived... many years before the diagnosis. You are NOT alone.
Becky has given you great advise: yes, I too tend to 'expond' when stressed, because I wanted to explain everything so they would understand! But.. the opposite is required.
If you are old (like me) you may remember an old TV show, where the exhausted, grumpy cop keeps saying.. "just the facts ma'am, just the facts"
This is sooooo true for your appointments. Remember that the job of finding the diagnosis is theirs... your job is to clearly, and calmly state your symptoms. Can you take a trusted person with you to your appointment; whose presence will keep you grounded, and help you feel calm?
I do wish for you to find a doctor whom you can work with. This road is a long one... but heavily travelled. Plz let us know how you get on.
All the best!
There are many tests for the myriad of autoimmune diseases.

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Thank you so much for your kind words, seriously! I do feel crazy, but I KNOW i'm just majorly stressed out. I keep repeatedly being told that my diagnostics are fine and I'm healthy... it REALLY wears me down, and I can't afford to be more worn down than I already am.

As for "old" - my legs have been deemed to have the nerve flow of a 90 year old, does that count?! I FEEL old, but... I'm only 41 😛 But I think I may know what show you're talking about, that's from my parents' era hehe

As for a trusted person to take with me... that is much more difficult. I don't have many of those now. A best friend (she would not be the one to keep me calm tho) and a cousin (that works constantly) - both of whom live 30-hour away from me, respectively. Due to recent and major life changes, my mom left her husband (yes, he is technically my father, but ugh) and moved to Colorado to be with her sister, so... yeah, I'm on my own. My son is almost 18, but he is autistic (needs care) and I wouldn't subject him to any of this. He IS the sole reason I haven't given up.

Hopefully the doctor's office will do as I have firmly requested and get me that referral to the rheumatologist, and we can go from there. 🙂

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@thecyborgenchi

Thank you so much for your kind words, seriously! I do feel crazy, but I KNOW i'm just majorly stressed out. I keep repeatedly being told that my diagnostics are fine and I'm healthy... it REALLY wears me down, and I can't afford to be more worn down than I already am.

As for "old" - my legs have been deemed to have the nerve flow of a 90 year old, does that count?! I FEEL old, but... I'm only 41 😛 But I think I may know what show you're talking about, that's from my parents' era hehe

As for a trusted person to take with me... that is much more difficult. I don't have many of those now. A best friend (she would not be the one to keep me calm tho) and a cousin (that works constantly) - both of whom live 30-hour away from me, respectively. Due to recent and major life changes, my mom left her husband (yes, he is technically my father, but ugh) and moved to Colorado to be with her sister, so... yeah, I'm on my own. My son is almost 18, but he is autistic (needs care) and I wouldn't subject him to any of this. He IS the sole reason I haven't given up.

Hopefully the doctor's office will do as I have firmly requested and get me that referral to the rheumatologist, and we can go from there. 🙂

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WOW! You have much to be stressed about. These social burdens, isolation and your dear son combine to drain our stamina! I can't be there for you, but we can read your notes, listen and send encouragement.
Do you have in your town any groups that meet: such as an arthritis group... you don't have a diagnosis yet, but you would find lots of folks who have gone through similar journeys. I do hope you can find a pair of compassionate ears! We all need them.
Perhaps there is a group at a mental health place that would have some meetings or 'something' for 'Stress', or for parents with kids with special needs? .. I'm just thinking of how / where you could find some support.
Personally, I have found groups have been a great place for support and learning. There was an Arthritis Clinic in my previous town, that offered several groups and therapy, etc.
In the meantime, you have 'Connect'!
Let us know how you get on with your appointment
All the best to you.

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I am pretty sure that a positive ANA CAN MEAN OTHER THINGS THAN lupus

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@thecyborgenchi

Thank you so much for your kind words, seriously! I do feel crazy, but I KNOW i'm just majorly stressed out. I keep repeatedly being told that my diagnostics are fine and I'm healthy... it REALLY wears me down, and I can't afford to be more worn down than I already am.

As for "old" - my legs have been deemed to have the nerve flow of a 90 year old, does that count?! I FEEL old, but... I'm only 41 😛 But I think I may know what show you're talking about, that's from my parents' era hehe

As for a trusted person to take with me... that is much more difficult. I don't have many of those now. A best friend (she would not be the one to keep me calm tho) and a cousin (that works constantly) - both of whom live 30-hour away from me, respectively. Due to recent and major life changes, my mom left her husband (yes, he is technically my father, but ugh) and moved to Colorado to be with her sister, so... yeah, I'm on my own. My son is almost 18, but he is autistic (needs care) and I wouldn't subject him to any of this. He IS the sole reason I haven't given up.

Hopefully the doctor's office will do as I have firmly requested and get me that referral to the rheumatologist, and we can go from there. 🙂

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@thecyborgenchi We have all learned to advocate for ourselves. It is proactive, helpful, fulfilling, frustrating, and rewarding - all at the same time!

While you plough through getting the correct diagnosis, a couple of things I would like to point out to you. Number one, we are all here to listen to you, and support you. Venting and getting feedback helps us get through the day. Number two, autoimmune conditions like lupus, can be real difficult to diagnose. I have heard it referred to as a "constellation disease", as there can be many facets to it. When I was diagnosed in 1988, there weren't the sophisticated tests available now, and they had to limp along.

Wishing you success in getting in to a rheumatologist soon, who can look at the whole picture and come up with a diagnosis/game plan!
Ginger

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@thisoldewe

WOW! You have much to be stressed about. These social burdens, isolation and your dear son combine to drain our stamina! I can't be there for you, but we can read your notes, listen and send encouragement.
Do you have in your town any groups that meet: such as an arthritis group... you don't have a diagnosis yet, but you would find lots of folks who have gone through similar journeys. I do hope you can find a pair of compassionate ears! We all need them.
Perhaps there is a group at a mental health place that would have some meetings or 'something' for 'Stress', or for parents with kids with special needs? .. I'm just thinking of how / where you could find some support.
Personally, I have found groups have been a great place for support and learning. There was an Arthritis Clinic in my previous town, that offered several groups and therapy, etc.
In the meantime, you have 'Connect'!
Let us know how you get on with your appointment
All the best to you.

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I refer to the area I live as a "black hole" for services/support/quality anything. It's a "small" town (12k+-), and I'll leave it at that. I've had to fight my son's whole life to make sure he gets what he needs, and now I'm fighting for myself. It's exhausting - and I'm ALREADY exhausted all the time anyway lol. I have been outsourcing support from here and Facebook support groups, that's the best I can do. It's enough to know that I'm not alone.

As for appointment... I got a call Monday from PCP office. They sent referral to someone that doesn't take my insurance, so I got that straightened out. Would've been great having to drive 45 minutes instead of 2 hours, buuuuut... black hole 😛

I'll be overextending myself and taking my son to visit family for the holiday and his birthday, so I probly won't get that appointment or be back on here until next year. So, I'll update when and as I can. I hope you have a great holiday!

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@gingerw

@thecyborgenchi We have all learned to advocate for ourselves. It is proactive, helpful, fulfilling, frustrating, and rewarding - all at the same time!

While you plough through getting the correct diagnosis, a couple of things I would like to point out to you. Number one, we are all here to listen to you, and support you. Venting and getting feedback helps us get through the day. Number two, autoimmune conditions like lupus, can be real difficult to diagnose. I have heard it referred to as a "constellation disease", as there can be many facets to it. When I was diagnosed in 1988, there weren't the sophisticated tests available now, and they had to limp along.

Wishing you success in getting in to a rheumatologist soon, who can look at the whole picture and come up with a diagnosis/game plan!
Ginger

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Sometimes I wish I had someone that could do all the advocating for me, because I am SO tired every single day and having to fight for things just adds to that. But, being able to get on here and see words of encouragement really does help, so thank you for that!

I do plan to call the rheumatologist office tomorrow and ask if they received my referral (though my insurance doesn't actually require one) and get an appointment set up. I'm hoping my PCP can send my medical history and recent blood work ahead of time. And unless they physically need me there for the first appointment, a tele-visit would be nice, but... I'll do what I need to, either way.

Hope you have a great holiday! I'll get back and update as soon as I can

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@thecyborgenchi

I refer to the area I live as a "black hole" for services/support/quality anything. It's a "small" town (12k+-), and I'll leave it at that. I've had to fight my son's whole life to make sure he gets what he needs, and now I'm fighting for myself. It's exhausting - and I'm ALREADY exhausted all the time anyway lol. I have been outsourcing support from here and Facebook support groups, that's the best I can do. It's enough to know that I'm not alone.

As for appointment... I got a call Monday from PCP office. They sent referral to someone that doesn't take my insurance, so I got that straightened out. Would've been great having to drive 45 minutes instead of 2 hours, buuuuut... black hole 😛

I'll be overextending myself and taking my son to visit family for the holiday and his birthday, so I probly won't get that appointment or be back on here until next year. So, I'll update when and as I can. I hope you have a great holiday!

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Yup, it is exhausting! Glad you are outsourcing: well done!
All the best to you and your boy; may you enjoy some good times during this holiday, and Happy Birthday to your son!

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Hey, I have had 3 positive ANA/Lupus tests, too, and still told I don't have Lupus, but they don't come up with anything else, either. Nor do they seem sincerely interested in exploring anything! I just continue to have problems. I also had another experience with 5 CRP tests [for inflammation]. Four of the tests came back with results ranging from 5.9 to 8.5, but the only one that actually registered as High was the 8.5. When I had the 5th test come back as 5.9 and indicating as High, I contacted the Dr who ordered the test. I gave him the dates of the other tests and the results that showed at 5.9 and plus, and asked him if the reference range has changed for this test because the first 5.9 result and other higher results did not come back as High. He messaged me back & told me to check with the rheumatologist he had referred me to at one time, so I did so. The rheumatologist told me that I would have to check back with the Dr who ordered the test!! And, so it goes! I am so tired of the runaround and no answers!! I think the Drs have gotten themselves so overburdoned with patients that they are a disservice to all they serve! Just saying!
P

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Are you sure they ran the same type of ANA lab each time? There are a few version. The IF(?) one that gives titers and pattern and a multiplex beaded assay which isn't the same at all. It's more like a collection of the individual antibody tests: Anti-Smith, Anti-Ro, etc.

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