1. < Osteoporosis & Bone Health

overwhelmed by so much (often conflicting) info on natural approaches

Posted by swuelfing1 @swuelfing1, Dec 3, 2023

Hi everyone, I was wondering if anyone else feels overwhelmed when researching what to do about dealing with osteoporosis naturally. There is so much good info out there which is great. It's just that often it gets sooo detailed such as in the area of supplements that it gets confusing or just overwhelming to decide what to do and narrow it down to a feasible plan. Also there are certain topics that there's controversy about - like yes/no on dairy, if dairy then which dairy, oxylates?, correct exercise? correct supplements, too much calcium? As you research you find several very credible and trustworthy resources who still disagree on so many topics. You could endlessly research and go down rabbitholes on every topic. Has anyone figured out any strategies to keep things manageable and decide what to do?

Interested in more discussions like this? Go to the Osteoporosis & Bone Health Support Group.

sc614 | @sc614 | Dec 7, 2023
In reply to @06111945cc "cpd54, Would you share with us the product and dosage of MK4 and MK7 you are..." + (show)
@06111945cc

cpd54,

Would you share with us the product and dosage of MK4 and MK7 you are taking please.

Also time of day.

Thanks.

cc

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At the risk of complicating the discussion I am linking a very comprehensive article on K2 forms, dosage, studies etc (It’s long so skim to relevant parts!)

https://melioguide.com/osteoporosis-nutrition/vitamin-k2-for-osteoporosis/
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1 reply
vgkime | @vgkime | Dec 8, 2023
In reply to @sc614 "At the risk of complicating the discussion I am linking a very comprehensive article on K2..." + (show)
@sc614

At the risk of complicating the discussion I am linking a very comprehensive article on K2 forms, dosage, studies etc (It’s long so skim to relevant parts!)

https://melioguide.com/osteoporosis-nutrition/vitamin-k2-for-osteoporosis/

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This is what Margaret Martin states on melioguide.com:
"A few more points about MK-4:

"The half-life of MK-4 is substantially less than that of its family member, MK-7, and as a result will stay in your body a shorter time.
Because of its short duration, you will likely have to take three daily doses of MK-4. One dose is adequate for MK-7.
The MK-4 you will find in dietary supplements is likely synthetic, whereas the MK-4 found is food is produced naturally by nature."

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HomeAgainLA | @llynch17056 | Dec 9, 2023
In reply to @gently "The problem is omniscience. No one has it. Lots of rabbit holes. Some well meaning, some..." + (show)
@gently

The problem is omniscience. No one has it.
Lots of rabbit holes. Some well meaning, some mercenary.
So take one thing at a time. Question everything. (I know you have other things to do) Don't hold any conclusion with a tight fist.
Start with calcium that will lead to K2 and D3.
Once you decide, it settles into routine. Then you can adjust here and there at leisure.
If I were osteopenic, I'd look closely at the Estrodial Patch.
It is easier to retain bone density than it is to regain bone density.
Best wishes for your bones

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What about hormones causing breast cancer risk?

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gently | @gently | Dec 10, 2023

HomeAgain,
important point. The low dose estrodiol patch is the only hormone replacement I'd consider. But even that weaker E2 at the low dose would be ill advised if you have genetic markers for breast cancer. The same genetic markers are thought to be indicative in prostate cancer, though testosterone is the marker. I wish everyone would have the genetic testing.

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gravity3 | @gravity3 | Dec 10, 2023
In reply to @naturegirl5 "@swuelfing1 Thank you for posting this. I’ve been thinking about this topic too. I heard an..." + (show)
@naturegirl5

@swuelfing1 Thank you for posting this. I’ve been thinking about this topic too.

I heard an excellent show yesterday on the radio on Nutrition and Health where the experts discussed the use of supplements for a variety of health conditions. Osteoporosis came up in the discussion. The consensus was this. Start with one’s diet. Try to get as much vitamins and minerals as required from your diet. The viewpoint was not to start with supplements but rather start with your diet. And then for osteoporosis (and heart disease as they came up in the radio program) figure out the exercise you need.

I tried for about 8 years to manage my osteoporosis with diet and exercise. I continued to lose bone density and so finally decided to go with medication. I was on Fosamax for 5 years and along with keeping up with diet and exercise I did gain bone density. Unfortunately, that was somewhat “undone” when I needed to address cancer recurrence (endometrial cancer) through radiation therapy. I lost some bone density through pelvic radiation which the radiation oncologist warned me about. I had a fracture in the sacrum. So now, with the advice of my Mayo Clinic endocrinologist, I’m on Evenity for 12 months.

The information on so-called natural approaches is conflicting. I think the best I can do is to talk with my doctors, the nutritionist, and do my own research. Then make a decision on what works best for me. For me, completely avoiding the use of osteoporosis medications by trying to go all natural just didn’t work as evidenced by the sacral fracture.

Which way are you leaning?

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Any thoughts on what you will use post evenity to retain bone gains? My endocrinologist wants.e to use prolia...scary

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1 reply
matilda1993 | @matilda1993 | Dec 11, 2023

To swuelfing1:

I am right with you. I follow Dr. Brown’s Better Bones and the Bone Coach. But after my recent confirmed OP diagnosis, I started a gentle bone exercise program and joined a Facebook group on natural osteoporosis approaches. I thought it would be people sharing their diets and what seems to work. It’s not - it’s a way of eating and very little supplements that turns all conventional ideas on calcium, vitamin D, trace minerals, on their heads.

So I’m at a loss what to do. One diet says plant based, another says meat and fats is needed (I lean vegetarian). No one completely agrees which foods are acid (bad) or alkaline (good). Do you eat calcium in foods, including dairy (which doesn’t agree with me) or use fortified plant milks?
I look at studies too. Sigh….

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2 replies
lamay | @lamay | Dec 11, 2023

Agree with everyone here -- getting the diagnosis was very nerve wracking then the amount of information online, much of it conflicting, from different providers, and in online forums is daunting and frustrating. I do recommend checking with consumer lab for info on supplements and for studies about K2 et al. I pay for the subscription.

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fayelouise | @fayelouise | Dec 12, 2023
In reply to @gravity3 "Any thoughts on what you will use post evenity to retain bone gains? My endocrinologist wants.e..." + (show)
@gravity3

Any thoughts on what you will use post evenity to retain bone gains? My endocrinologist wants.e to use prolia...scary

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I am feeling the same way. I just finished my year on Evenity and am waiting for my DEXA in February and then a consult with my doctor. I had planned on just using my Juvent plate, and the vitamins I am on. But then, I read how painful the fractures are that now I don’t know what to do! I have a couple months to decide before seeing my doctor again. I think he usually prescribes Prolia. And from what I read about it, I definitely don’t want to take it. Several years back, I took Fosamax, and got a lot of chest pain from it.

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allthatjaz | @allthatjaz | Dec 12, 2023
In reply to @jasperina "Great thread topic. I was recently diagnosed with osteoporosis and told to take fosomax and calcium..." + (show)
@jasperina

Great thread topic. I was recently diagnosed with osteoporosis and told to take fosomax and calcium by my NP. I am 67 and got Dexa results of 3.1 spine and 1.5 FN. I asked for a referral to an endo before making decisions about drugs, but won’t see that person until March. I found this group and read through everything and was referred to Dr. Keith McCormick by several people. I have read his books and re-reading parts of them as the info is quite dense.

My approach for now is for a nutritional/exercise foundation. I use an app called Cronometer which tracks your food and gives you detailed information about the nutrient profile. I only take calcium if I will not get enough from food on a given day. I strive for 30-40 grams of protein at each meal. I take several other supplements including McCormick’s Osteostim product. I bought a nutribullet so it’s easier to take in more leafy greens.

I’ve always been active, but more on the cardio side so I have added a weightlifting program with a trainer in addition to continuing walk/jog 3-4 miles a day. We are building toward implementing the heavier exercises described in the LIFTMOR study.

Dr. McCormick is not against using medications to “get you out of a hole”, while still continuing a foundation of nutrition/good sleep/exercise, so I am open to considering medication in the future.

I will see what the endo says in March.

This group has been the best source of information so far. I appreciate all of you.

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Hi Jasperina,
I to am in the 3.1 and some lower numbers and do not want to rush into the Fosomax….. my pcp says the endo will tell me the same thing. So I’m thinking about just getting a second opinion from naturopath or even another pcp
Until then, I’m eat well ,walk up many stairs walking flat and hills some running, yoga, lite weights. Vit. Min.
I’m doing Dr Fishmans 12 step yoga
Thanks, Karen

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joyboudreau | @joyboudreau | Dec 15, 2023
In reply to @matilda1993 "There are so many different natural no drug programs which offer conflicting advice. It’s overwhelming! I..." + (show)
@matilda1993

There are so many different natural no drug programs which offer conflicting advice. It’s overwhelming! I just was diagnosed a with osteoporosis (after being very close with osteopenia). I haven’t read one thing that convinces me to start the drugs.

I’m also following the concept that the Dexa is not accurate and that it doesn’t prove bone fragility. That said, I sure don’t want to risk fracture. I’m trying to avoid the twisting and bending which was part of my yoga routine for years.

I’ve started an online osteo exercise program, increasing my walking while wearing my weighted vest, and using a vibration plate.

As far as nutrition, I’m sorting out the programs and studies. What I’ve gotten so far is that getting nutrition through foods is best. Vitamin D from the sun. Natural sources for calcium not sources with added calcium like OJ. I take many supplements which maybe are not helping, or maybe my Tscore would have been worse without them. I don’t think the researchers know yet the exact nutritional needs to increase bone strength. It’s sure not pop a calcium pill, which is what most doctors tell you.

I’m interested in hearing success stories. Sending ❤️ to everyone.

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I would be interested in the online ostero exercise program you are using. I am so tired of guessing and hoping I am doing what I should do...

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