The Wages of a missed Neb session.

Posted by thumperguy @thumperguy, Jun 3, 2021

Here I am at 10:30 Thursday evening, aerosolized saline pestering my throat. Later getting to this chore tonight; tuckered, secondary to deciding earlier today that some soil in my yard would better suit me if was at a different spot in my yard. I’ve known for a long time that when one begins to rearrange the surface of the planet it almost immediately becomes very labor intensive. That in turn leads to my body feeling like Beef Jerky looks, all wizened and gnarly.

My question: how often, if ever, do you skip a treatment session?

Interested in more discussions like this? Go to the MAC & Bronchiectasis Support Group.

@ljfoo

I huff cough lying on my back and roll to my side to spit out the mucus and then while on my side Huff cough some more to spit out more mucus before lying down again starting the process over. I do this for 9 minutes. I'm trying to find a respiratory therapist to tell me if I'm doing it right so I don't straighten my diaphragm and lower back but I am having a very hard time finding such a therapist.

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I meant strain my diaphragm, not straighten....

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@ljfoo

I meant strain my diaphragm, not straighten....

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ljfoo, How about trusting what feels intuitively “right “ to you. I’d avoid huffing so energetically that your eyes are bulging like an old-time cartoon character. Don

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@ckscoville

alessandre, I understand how you're feeling. I'm 73 and do two half-hour sessions a day wearing a SmartVest while nebulizing albuterol then 7% saline. It's a routine I've REALLY grown tired of, but I've also experienced what happens when I miss a session. As a CF patient, I realize that i can't afford any shortcuts, and the Trikafta I'm on (for the CF) is a blessing, but the two sessions a day still totally wear me out!

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I hear you. I tried one of the Vest models, didn't help bring up phlegm for me & anyway I find a $15,000-$25,000 piece of equipment problematic on principle. Our healthcare system often seems to be more about draconian & expensive methodologies & maximization of profits along the way than about holistic healthcare. I've felt that nebulizing - but only once a day, my PERSONAL limit - with 7% saline & glutathione has probably been beneficial because I'm conversant with the benefits to lungs of both substances; but nebulizing doesn't bring up much phlegm for me - my system does that on its own for about an hour after I've gotten out of bed. & I feel I can't miss more than 3 once a day neb sessions a week. But cannot do without my nightly postural drainage cum Acapela, tho' it's the coughing in several different postures & the breathing patterns that seem more responsible for bringing up the (typically 1/4-1/2 cup of phlegm) than does the device. Re the device: I'd started with the Acapela, equipment businesses came up with one allegedly better & more expensive device then subsequently with the even more expensive & allegedly better still Aerobika. I bought & tried both & for me the only difference besides increased cost & no doubt profit to manufacturers is that while Acapela required the cleaning of only 2 parts, the subsequent device had 3 parts & Aerobika 4 to clean. So I've remained with Acap. Sorry if I sound cynical but I've been dealing with our healthcare system
regularly since first being treated for cancer when I was 26. I've learned to be cautious about putting all my trust in it; to require that MDs call me Ms. ________ rather than by my first name - to prevent my feeling less than a partner in determining healthcare measures but rather more like a dependent child when dealing with them;
to do some research on my own; & to check out integrative & alternative perspectives. While this approach has served me, I understand that it isn't right for everyone. Blessings!

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I skip nebulizing more than I should.

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I wondered myself about the detriment of skipping nebulizing. I am supposed to do it twice daily with a percussion vest and Volara machine at the same time. I really try to do it twice daily but when traveling usually just do once daily with my Pari nebulizer which I think works well. And if I have an appointment I won't nebulize first as I don't want to cough all during the appt. I have gone a day a two with just nebuliizing once. So far my MD at my appointments has said my chest it stable so guess it is ok so far.

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@gej53

I wondered myself about the detriment of skipping nebulizing. I am supposed to do it twice daily with a percussion vest and Volara machine at the same time. I really try to do it twice daily but when traveling usually just do once daily with my Pari nebulizer which I think works well. And if I have an appointment I won't nebulize first as I don't want to cough all during the appt. I have gone a day a two with just nebuliizing once. So far my MD at my appointments has said my chest it stable so guess it is ok so far.

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Well, I guess like all other practices related to MAC and Bronchiectasis, it depends...for a year I nebbed 7% saline twice a day after I quit antibiotics but still had a positive culture. When having issues with asthma and allergies I switched from levalbuterol inhaler to neb, then back when better.

Over a year ago, I changed to: once a day saline nebs, daily flovent inhaler, levalbuterol only as needed, added1200 mg daily Nacetyl-cysteine and 1200 mg daily Ulimate Omega, saline neb daily (once) . If allergies or asthma kick up, I add levalbuterol as needed and increase saline neb. I have also taken Mucinex and Singulair daily for many years.
In 14 months I have had one exacerbation that required short courses of steroids and antibiotics.

In December 2021 my followup CT showed no change for 2 years, neither did my O2 seats or spirometry. My airway clearance is Aerobika or just huff coughing depending on how much crud I have and how I feel. My docs are happy with my health.

This works for me, but may not be nearly enough for someone else. Each of us needs to do enough to stay healthy, while still living our best life.

Do you find you feel better with more frequent with neb?
Sue

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@sueinmn

Well, I guess like all other practices related to MAC and Bronchiectasis, it depends...for a year I nebbed 7% saline twice a day after I quit antibiotics but still had a positive culture. When having issues with asthma and allergies I switched from levalbuterol inhaler to neb, then back when better.

Over a year ago, I changed to: once a day saline nebs, daily flovent inhaler, levalbuterol only as needed, added1200 mg daily Nacetyl-cysteine and 1200 mg daily Ulimate Omega, saline neb daily (once) . If allergies or asthma kick up, I add levalbuterol as needed and increase saline neb. I have also taken Mucinex and Singulair daily for many years.
In 14 months I have had one exacerbation that required short courses of steroids and antibiotics.

In December 2021 my followup CT showed no change for 2 years, neither did my O2 seats or spirometry. My airway clearance is Aerobika or just huff coughing depending on how much crud I have and how I feel. My docs are happy with my health.

This works for me, but may not be nearly enough for someone else. Each of us needs to do enough to stay healthy, while still living our best life.

Do you find you feel better with more frequent with neb?
Sue

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Hi Sue! Thanks for all that info. Since joining this forum I always read what you have to say as it carries as much weight with me as my own physician's advice. Since beginning the nebulizing I was always told to do it twice daily. My nebulizer was advanced to the volara machine, a percussion vest was added and I began using 7% saline after joining this forum. I initially had a dry cough and now it is much more "wet". In two years my CT's have been stable and my pulmonary function tests have improved so I think the regime is working. I try to faithfully do twice daily but can't always do that and try to get in at least one treatment a day. I also use a travel nebulizer when on the road, which is usually once a day, So for the most part I do twice daily and feel this will carry me for those times I only do once daily or am on the road with the travel nebulizer. I do not travel with the vest, just nebulize. So I think this regime is helping me to hold my own. I always read the frequency of what others do and now feel that when I do have to miss that it is maybe not such a terrible thing. I did develop a rotator cuff tear and am heading for surgery for that. Will not be able to use the vest for awhile so maybe will add Mucinex during that time. I hear it is a rough surgery so will see. Thanks for all your advice on the forum.
Gail

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@sueinmn

You are so right. I live that 24/7 with my husband who is diabetic, arthritic & has a hearing loss and have now added my 41yo daughter, who has chronic health issues and is recovering from a badly broken wrist & surgery.
This morning one of my best friends is in the ER with her husband, who is blind, has COPD and kidney failure, once again because he refuses to drink water and everything goes "kaflooey."
Sometimes, the best thing we can do is take a step back and be quiet for a while, then when the next crisis arrives, try to clue the doctor to what is going on and get her/him to press treatment options.
Another tactic I have tried with some success is to pick a clam moment and address how ONE aspect of their health impacts me (eg When you get low blood sugar, I get scared, it makes me worried that you are going to get sicker and we'll have to quit traveling, and I don't think I can do "XX" without your help. I would like to help keep it controlled better by giving you small, healthy snacks to eat even when you don't think you are hungry. Is there anything I else I can do to support you?)
Sometimes it takes 2-3 reps to sink in. Maybe your wife is reluctant to get into the fun of nebulizing, sitting, then cleaning...can you possible offer to take care of set up and cleaning of her equipment, and provide books, puzzles to work on? I tolerate nebbing better sitting in front of a fun jigsaw puzzle.
Sue

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Yes! I have bee setting up her medicine trays for the past 20 years. There is nothing I will not do, if only I can get her to agree to do it. It is just when she set her mind on not doing something, no matter how much it might help her, she will not do it.Right now, the doctors are suggesting Insulin to control her blood sugar, but she is saying "no way"....So I am in a "wait and see" posture...

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@egayle187

@rits....I agree with you. My neb and postural draining take 3 hours a day and I try never to miss them. I work on puzzles during nebulizing and listen to books on tape during draining. These activities make coughing tolerable.
I have been free of MAC for 6 years now and had only one or two bronciectasis exacerbations. Prior to treatment I had exacerbations every 6 weeks at least. The neb treatments keep my asthma under control unless I experience extraordinary triggers. I am content with the treatments, since I remember how horrible it was to cough 24 hours a day.

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Gayle, I noticed somewhere that you’re a “therapist.” Just curious; physical, psycho, or hybrid?

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@thumperguy

Gayle, I noticed somewhere that you’re a “therapist.” Just curious; physical, psycho, or hybrid?

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Psychotherapist. CBT with children mostly, but any adult who lived in our rural area would seek me out.

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