Transitioning from High Dose Opiates to Suboxone for Chronic Pain

@faithgirl30 they've never used it for pain or else they would know. It doesn't help. I've been on Suboxone since 2012. I didn't have pain when I first started it. I was just addicted to opiates. I already posted something about it earlier. Now that I have extreme pain from scoliosis, it doesn't help whatsoever. I take gabapentin and 800 mg ibuprofen. The only thing that helps is ice to numb the pain and that doesn't last very long.

@catheem - Bupronorphine is synthetic morphine and usually takes a few weeks to initiate pain relief to the patient. I have been taking in slowly increasing dosages for arthritis in my spine that has recently been compounded by osteoporosis and the discovery of fractured vertebrae at L3/L4 (old fractures that have become deformed) also at T 12 and L1. I also have two replacement hips, the first in 2016 and the second in 2019…..and recently underwent open heart bypass surgery that while being perfectly successful - it seems that my lungs have been arguing with it ever since😂😂.

@dollydutchgirl1946 What is your current dosage that has given you pain relief? I have been on as much as 8/2 mg taken twice a day and I don't feel any pain relief whatsoever. I take this in combination with 900 mg gabapentin and 16 mg ibuprofen daily. It helps very little with the pain.
I have degenerative thoracic and lumbar scoliosis and kyphosis. I've only had this for the last 5 years and so grateful I didn't have it all my life. If it helps you, I'm very happy.

@jdkitkat129 my Bupronorphine is via a patch, that releases 15 micrograms every hour for a week. I then change the patch and the process starts all over again. However, the patch is backed up with 60mg of Duloxatine each morning, together with 1000mg of Paracetamol 3 or 4 times a day. However, because of Stage 3 CKD and Asthma, I’m unable to take Ibuprofen. Because of a lot of health issues, I have to take 10 pills every morning, plus my asthma inhalers then, 4 pills midday and, another 10 pills at night….along with my asthma inhalers etc: I have an appointment with my GP to discuss possible medication for my osteoporosis that has recently been diagnosed. Because of all of my other issues - deciding on the correct osteoporosis medication is quite difficult.

Hi! I’m sorry you’re in so much pain constantly. I definitely empathize with you. I have fibromyalgia, chronic migraines, congenital fused cervical vertebrae, cervical dystonia, connective tissue disease, and chronic pain (all over my body and especially in my stomach and gut) to name a few. I had a Nissen fundoplication 360 done at JHU in Baltimore in my early 20’s and unfortunately the surgeon damaged my entire GI system - the wrap was done too tightly (now have esophageal spasms daily), now have gastroparesis, vagus nerve damage, and I had to have a total colectomy with ileostomy, ileostomy reversal, and small bowel resection as a result. I also had a revision of the Nissen to a 270.

I had been taking oxycodone for pain and on occasion Dilaudid for very bad symptoms. My obstetrician suggests that I try Subutex after I had my baby bc he said it had better pain control. So I did.

No one told me or warned me that taking sublingual Subutex could and would damage my teeth. Subutex did not damage my teeth but literally cause them to crumble out of my mouth. My teeth started breaking off in small pieces at first and then progressed to chunks. At first it was when I biting into something or chewing but towards the end I would feel a piece of my tooth on my tongue when I was talking. My entire mouth felt like I desperately needed a root canal for each tooth.

After seeing several dentists, periodontists, etc for second and third opinions they all said that there was no way to save my remaining teeth.

I’m in my early 40’s and had to have my last 6 remaining upper teeth extracted bc of a terrible bone infection in my mouth due to the Subutex rotting my teeth. I will most likely have to have my remaining bottom teeth extracted as well bc they are cracking off and the nerves are exposed.

I states getting symptoms 5-6 months after I started taking the sublingual Subutex.

I highly recommend and urge you to discuss this often not talked about side effect with your doctors and dentist and to do as much research as you can on this medication. One dentist told me that having Subutex sitting in your mouth waiting to dissolve is like having a strip of pill in your mouth that is pure acid.

I wish someone had told me the risks of taking this medication. I may still have tried it but would have also know to stop taking it when I first started having symptoms.

I wish you the best of luck! And sorry for my terribly long reply.

@ga1rose I forgot to add that getting implants for all of my upper teeth is very expensive (Im trying to save) so in the meantime I’m left with a full denture for my upper teeth and will likely have a full bottom denture in the next year.

@jdkitkat129
Similiar, but recently had pain doc drop me, as I willingly gave up a 17 year opiate prescription, as the pain had abated quite a bit.
She told me her patients only get worse not better, but it was scary, having been on the subs route 2012 I think, what a bitch that stuff is. Gabapentin every freaking whatever drug imaginable, but it all started to (slowly) change after reading this, chapters 6-8 are like reading an autobiography, all doctors talking.
The connection between grief, trauma and pain cannot be overstated, and I have the scans and MRI'S and endless ER visits blah blah but what really really changed things from a physical standpoint, was dealing with deep seated lifetime childhood trauma.
Now? After being non ambulatory or barely there for 2 years, have ditched the cane, lost the lifelong limp, went from not getting mail or driving anywhere to jumping jacks and working on a 12 foot ladder at the house.
TBH, was in so much pain at one point, literally begged God to not let me wake up, it was that bad nothing touched it, hips spine etc so I get it.
4 advil every 4 hours around clock and still barely touched it.
3 dosepaks in a row just to stand.
Now? Can run if need be, barely take anything any more, feel like some prisoner liberated from jail, and thank God every day.
For not listening to me.
Don't miss any of it.

@marky777 I would love to be in that position but I'm not sure where to even begin. I wish you could tell me how. Thanks so much for your response.

@jdkitkat129 my last trigger point injection appt was 3/26 this year. Canceled the appt which was scary, those shots kept me driving and walking and upright for at least 1-2 weeks, which had me counting days until next injection, if that stopped working the next option we were exploring was the shot they give you in the hospital.
But mid to late last year somehow ran across that book, and marked up so much of it that related to myself personally, that i grabbed a highlighter especially chapters 6-8, then passed it off to my pain doc, she took it home and checked it out, was 100 down with the idea but when I passed the script back, she said they can't see me any more per insurance, no shots no pills, on my own now, the sense of freedom is beyond liberating, not knowing nor caring about canes and placards any more, and those trigger points that one touch would have me on knees? Gone. Just gone.
For the first time in I don't know how long, the gait feels normal, even, steady.
Have 24 MRI's, Xrays CAT scans PET scans at radnet, about half for my MS and the rest for orthopedic, was non-ambulatory & mostly housebound for so long, was resigned to fate.

That all (started) changing when all that trauma was dealt with, started with a PTSD coach online, that was like opening up a Pandoras box that had been closed for many many decades.
And as that past slowly released it's grip, it was like you could feel the pain leaving the body, not all at once but slowly over time, then after a church service on 4/11 at 2:45 pm it was like POOF, legs came back. Limp vanished, have been "running" ever since.
Told everyone I know and they know you are speaking truth as they saw you using cane and placard for a long time.

John Sarno delves into the physical reality of psychosomatic disease processes. It is *very* real, the pain is real, but it is also very treatable.

Trauma can be a lot of things, events in life that then are reflected in our physical body. Death or divorce or loss or (name it) contribute to that process, the brain is very powerful, and also very protective, when our brain has been traumatized and shocked it can manifest in the body, sometimes even relocate to different areas.

Mark.

I was on Roxy 10mg and once I was diagnosed with fibromyalgia they were immediately taken away. I got hydrocodone 5mg for 3 yrs then got the Roxy 10mg for 3 months but the very day my neurologist at the time diagnosed me with fibromyalgia he said they weren’t an approved treatment even though they were helping my pain. I was also on gabapentin 300 mg 3x per day. I was suffering horribly and someone gave me a very tiny piece of a suboxone that got me out of bed and I felt great all day no pain at all. So I decided to go to a clinic and been on suboxone since. I never abused my pain meds and I wish I hadn’t started the suboxone beca Now I’m labeled with opioid use disorder. But that’s not the case. Yet my permanent medical record will forever say I have opioid use disorder. So yeah I’m treated differently. I am currently getting myself off the gabapentin due to it causing dementia. Suboxone definitely helps my pain. I did a medical detox inpatient to get off suboxone in 2018. I was in so much pain I barely got out of bed. I filed for disability but I couldn’t take the pain anymore and knowing no dr was gonna give me anything for the pain I went back to the suboxone clinic. Once I was back on it I could work and live a more normal life. I have recently been diagnosed with RA with is very painful too and also psoriasis with also causes joint pain. My feet kill me everyday. I use a lot of lidocaine and this compound lotion by prescription only with gabapentin lidocaine and a muscle relaxant in it. It’s expensive but a little goes a long way and you don’t get the same side effects as u get by taking gabapentin and muscle relaxers orally. That’s a plus! It took a long time to get this script for the lotion because it’s not approved by fda so a lot of doctors act like they have no idea what I’m talking about. Sorry this is long but the answer to your question isn’t a simple answer. It’s becoming almost impossible to get opioids for pain. Suboxone helps me live a more normal life, I work as a server in a tourist town I’m wide open the whole shift. By the time I get off I’m hurting bad and require at least a quarter of my suboxone film. I take my
1st dose at 4am then around 2 to 4 pm I take the 1/4. It gives me relief and energy. I suffer chronic fatigue as well. So for me it works. But this medication has completely destroyed my teeth. Within a couple years of taking suboxone my death started decaying after never having any dental issues. I had 1 cavity as a kid. By 2021 I had all my top teeth pulled. By 2023 i needed all my bottom teeth removed but don’t have the money at this time. That’s the biggest issue with suboxone and due to my states laws on statute of limitations I didn’t qualify for the class action lawsuit against suboxone. So if you go with suboxone make sure after to take the medication and the 20 min is up for it to dissolve use mouthwash and brush your teeth. If you take more later in the day then brush again. Drink lots of water or use something to help dry mouth. Go to dentist every 6 months for cleaning so they can keep an eye on ur teeth. Best of luck to you