Improve bone density and strength without medication?

Posted by plav @plav, Dec 20, 2023

Any luck improving bone density and strength without medication? It seems the medications only mildly help ... and they only help some patients; some studies show the slight improvement in density does not mean quality bone was built. I'm not comfortable with moving forward with the treatments just because "that's what we give patients with osteoporosis". There seems to be no room for education or discussion, or research into actual results or other options.

Interested in more discussions like this? Go to the Osteoporosis & Bone Health Support Group.

Profile picture for windyshores @windyshores

@jodani and @trixie girl, strontium can make the DEXA results look better than they are. Strontium is denser than calcium, and it replaces calcium in the bones. Therefore the bones look denser. Some radiologists might be able to adjust for that.

I am not taking away from your amazing efforts to maintain bone density. But those reading posts about strontium might benefit from understanding its effect on DEXA's/

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@windyshores, I believe you helped me understand that DEXA could look better and I used the formula to adjust for that. Thank you!

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Profile picture for cpd54 @cpd54

My scores are like yours. But I haven’t had a fracture. I’ve had 3 doctors tell me not to take drugs, an orthopedic surgeon, a functional medicine doctor and my dentist. My planned course of action is for 2 years try to do everything possible to up my scores without meds. Then have another dexa and see. My daily supplements are recommended by my FMD. Calcium citrate or malate- 1000 mg daily( I take Osteo-K by NBI), D3 5000 IU (I was significantly low), a B complex, Magnesium 2:1 ratio to calcium (I take citrate and glycinate), Vit K2 (I’ve done a lot if research on this one. FMD said up to 45 mg. That’s MK4. There is also MK7 that I take every other day at 182 mcg.), Boron 3 mg, Copper .9mg, Zinc 15 mg , Manganese- 1.8-23 mg, selenium 55 mcg. A lot of these I get with my multi vitamin.
She also recommended yoga, fast walking, stomping and whole body vibration for exercise.
You will find TONS of info and opinions about osteoporosis when you start researching. To me, you do what s best for you based on your health and comfort. I’m not comfortable taking the drugs. I’ll reassess after my next Dexa. Also there are other tests, P1NP and CTX, you can do to determine the action of your bone building.
I would suggest reading Dr Keith McCormicks books as well as Vitamin K2 and the Calcium Paradox by Kate Rheaume-Bleue. Also I’ve just started watching Dr Doug Lucas on YouTube.
Good luck in your journey.

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@plav @cpd54 I am just going through some of these discussion threads and was wondering if you ended up having to take meds or are you still trying to improve the natural way? I was recently diagnosed (tscore of-3.2 spine, -2.2 hips). FRAX score is excellent; less than 1% chance of hip fracture, 5% chance of osteoporotic fracture. I am 5’1”, 100 pounds, 64 YO. Very active.
No underlying causes for OP; just menopause and not getting enough calcium before.
So I decided not to do meds now, trying to improve or stay stable by using proper nutrition, supplements, strength training, etc. I will reassess in a year then I will decide my next step. Any advice from you both would be appreciated

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Profile picture for shelldct1 @shelldct1

@plav @cpd54 I am just going through some of these discussion threads and was wondering if you ended up having to take meds or are you still trying to improve the natural way? I was recently diagnosed (tscore of-3.2 spine, -2.2 hips). FRAX score is excellent; less than 1% chance of hip fracture, 5% chance of osteoporotic fracture. I am 5’1”, 100 pounds, 64 YO. Very active.
No underlying causes for OP; just menopause and not getting enough calcium before.
So I decided not to do meds now, trying to improve or stay stable by using proper nutrition, supplements, strength training, etc. I will reassess in a year then I will decide my next step. Any advice from you both would be appreciated

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If you are going to do that, I would get the P1NP and CTX blood tests beforehand as a baseline. Then, check them in six months - no need to wait for a year. You can see if what you are doing is having an effect. If you see CTX going up, that's a sign that you may be getting worse.

Remember that it's important to have those tests first thing in the morning, fasting. CTX in particular can vary wildly during the day.

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Profile picture for njx58 @njx58

If you are going to do that, I would get the P1NP and CTX blood tests beforehand as a baseline. Then, check them in six months - no need to wait for a year. You can see if what you are doing is having an effect. If you see CTX going up, that's a sign that you may be getting worse.

Remember that it's important to have those tests first thing in the morning, fasting. CTX in particular can vary wildly during the day.

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I did get my CTX and P1NP tested. CTX is 464. P1NP is 63. So I need to get my CTX to go down, correct?

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Profile picture for shelldct1 @shelldct1

I did get my CTX and P1NP tested. CTX is 464. P1NP is 63. So I need to get my CTX to go down, correct?

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Yes. CTX measures bone breakdown. You want the P1NP:CTX ratio to be better than it is now.

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Profile picture for gently @gently

plav, you've come to the right place. Options that's our main topic.
Medication help some patients dramatically. They have hurt some dramatically as well. For example I have had significant results with Forteo, another commentator. windyshores, had adverse events with Forteo, but success with Tymlos.
It you throw your numbers in or tell us what you are being encouraged to take, we'll tell you things even your reticent medical providers don't know.
The truth for your body will be a little different from our truths.
Welcome. it's pretty interesting.

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@gently I am 75 years old and excellent health only take statins 5 mg two days a week which does the job and nothing else. I have osteoporosis at -2.6 in my spine osteopenia in my hips osteopenia in my neck and osteoporosis in my forearm I had last November and L2 an L4 fracture from a hard fall. I would like to do everything I can and not to take medication is this possible?

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Profile picture for lindamaegirl @lindamaegirl

@gently I am 75 years old and excellent health only take statins 5 mg two days a week which does the job and nothing else. I have osteoporosis at -2.6 in my spine osteopenia in my hips osteopenia in my neck and osteoporosis in my forearm I had last November and L2 an L4 fracture from a hard fall. I would like to do everything I can and not to take medication is this possible?

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@lindamaegirl I really like the idea of low-dose statins, 5x a week… hope that works with more meds ! My doc has me on low-dose levothyroxine, but has me split the pills 2x a week— may seek to reduce it more , due to OP. Anyway, it’s important to research all options and consult with a doc who listens, to help sort it out…fractures may affect future decisions…wish you the best…keep us informed !

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Profile picture for lindamaegirl @lindamaegirl

@gently I am 75 years old and excellent health only take statins 5 mg two days a week which does the job and nothing else. I have osteoporosis at -2.6 in my spine osteopenia in my hips osteopenia in my neck and osteoporosis in my forearm I had last November and L2 an L4 fracture from a hard fall. I would like to do everything I can and not to take medication is this possible?

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@lindamaegirl -2.6 is barely osteoporosis. You could probably pay attention to nutrition and the proper weight-bearing exercise to avoid meds. I wouldn't do nothing at all, though, because it can get worse.

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Profile picture for lindamaegirl @lindamaegirl

@gently I am 75 years old and excellent health only take statins 5 mg two days a week which does the job and nothing else. I have osteoporosis at -2.6 in my spine osteopenia in my hips osteopenia in my neck and osteoporosis in my forearm I had last November and L2 an L4 fracture from a hard fall. I would like to do everything I can and not to take medication is this possible?

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@lindamaegirl, yes. It is entirely your decision.
Though it is very difficult to regain lost bone, there are measures you can take to reduce the risk. You can take collagen type 11, quercetin, tea, calcium+k2, make sure your D levels are adequate. Some people take strontium citrate. https://connect.mayoclinic.org/discussion/strontium-1/
You might eliminate the activities that could incur the hard fall that fractured L2 and 4. Do measured careful exercise, avoid lifting, especially lifting and twisting because L1,3 and 5 sustain vulnerability from the year old fractures that alter the balance of the entire spine.
Increasing muscle protects the spine as well as creating crosstalk that increases vertebral strength. But you have to be careful because your muscles can be stronger than your bones. LIfting weights can create peak pressure that your bones cannot sustain.
Some with low bone density never fracture, but many with osteopenia do fracture.
I wish you every luck whichever decision you make.
It is a risk that I wouldn't take, but my fear of fracture is great.
Windyshores had the best results with Tymlos. She cleverly manipulated the pen so she had control over the dosage. Her doctor was (probably still is) Michael Mannstadt 617-726-8720.
I think he still does virtual visits.
If you did decide on a medication, I would rather it would not be Reclast, at least yet. It is better to start with an anabolic like Forteo. I'd recommend Forteo except that windyshores had a negative reaction to it. If you couldn't tolerate Tymlos, like Forteo, it leaves you system rapidly, so your reaction would be limited in time to 24 hours max.

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Profile picture for lindamaegirl @lindamaegirl

@gently I am 75 years old and excellent health only take statins 5 mg two days a week which does the job and nothing else. I have osteoporosis at -2.6 in my spine osteopenia in my hips osteopenia in my neck and osteoporosis in my forearm I had last November and L2 an L4 fracture from a hard fall. I would like to do everything I can and not to take medication is this possible?

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@lindamaegirl
Igor Klibaov’s book Osteoporosis Reversal Secrets available on Amazon is a good place to start looking at how to manage and build without meds - osteoporosis meds are severe and shouldn’t be handed out as lightly as they are by docs now.

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