Excruciating chronic left side neck pain plus lumbar issues

Posted by AlfredB @ab6540183, Dec 23, 2022

Hi Everyone,

I just joined and this is my first post.
I am a 66 year old male that lives in Melbourne Aus.
Thankfully I found this discussion forum in order to get answers in regards to my deteriorating condition.

For the last 20 years I have been an active sportsman doing long distance bicycle riding and body building, but in the last 9 years I have been hit 3 times (2013,2015,2019) by negligent drivers while riding. These accidents have caused me severe whiplash and a multitude of fractures.

Each time I recovered and went back doing my riding passion.

4 months ago I noticed a pretty strong left sided pain around C6 therefore I went to see physiotherapists and osteopaths. But 4 weeks later at the end of August, this pain got even worse when one night while lying down on my loungeroom carpet, I got up and felt multiple crackles in the spine. It didn't hurt at the time therefore I went to sleep and woke up half hour later in extreme pain going from the left side of my neck, left side of my thoracic spine. I felt as if I was twisted. I was unable to sleep or sit. Standing provided some relief but I couldn't sleep.

Things slightly improved over the next 3 weeks.
I had some MRIs done at the end of August 2022 which showed:

C2/C3:
[No protuberant osteophyte, disc bulging, spinal canal stenosis or
neural foramina stenosis.]
C3/C4:
Minimal broad base central and bilateral lateral disc bulging with
associated minimal right intervertebral foramina stenosis
C4/C5:
Broad-based central and right lateral disc bulging with associated
moderate right intervertebral foraminal stenosis
C5/C6:
Disc bulging resulting in moderate bilateral intervertebral foraminal
stenosis
C6/C7:
Right lateral/foraminal disc bulging resulting in moderate right
intervertebral foramina stenosis

C7/T1:
[No protuberant osteophyte, disc bulging, spinal canal stenosis or
neural foramina stenosis.]
Conclusion:
Multilevel disc bulging and multilevel intervertebral foraminal stenosis. To see the complete reports open the attached PDF.

I contacted TAC which in Australia stands for Transport Accident Commission. They are responsible for paying medical expenses for anyone who has been a victim of a transport accident. Every driver in Victoria pays a premium yearly when they renew their car registration.

I arranged an appointment here to see first and orthopaedic surgeon and then a neurosurgeon. The first specialist told me that I had C6 nerve root impingement and the second specialist reported facet joint syndrome in the neck.

The injury is defined as a mechanical injury.
I noticed a discrepancy between the 2 opinions which left me frustrated. None of the specialists can pin point the exact source of the pain. They both recommended pain management and I am currently on Endep 10, Catapress 100 and Targin 10/5 daily.

Also I was told that no operation for this condition was required and ultimately a fusion, if non invasive, minimally invasive therapies didn't work.

This maybe ok as a temporary solution, but it can't be a life long remedy, because these medicines have side effects and I can't even drive the car to the supermarket when I am drowsy.

In the mean time I had C6 nerve root cortisone injection at the hospital on 1 of DEC 2022, but it didn't work at all after 3 weeks.
I actually have more pain than ever before something like 30% more. I queried the hospital, but they told me that it was done correctly.

Just a few days ago I have had fresh, new MRIs of the cervical/thoracic spine and a bone scan of the whole spine.

Yesterday 23.12.2022, according to the pain management specialist and the neuro surgeon, they couldn't find a lot of difference compared to the previous MRIs taken in August. They were perplexed as to why I feel so much pain. They can't pinpoint the source of the pain.

This is not very re-assuring and I have to keep taking drugs for the next 6 weeks. If I don't take the medication I have extreme, 10 out 10 burning pain that starts around left of neck at C6 going through C7, T1, T2, T3. The pain is also spreading aggressively in the left of my trapezius muscle. I have referred pain in the left shoulder, left scapula, left bicep/triceps and in the little, medium, index finger and left thumb. Referred pain is also felt in the right but not as bad. I also get pain going into my left pec muscle but it is not related to the heart. My cardiologist told that I am fine there even though I can get high blood pressure when I am anxious and stressed out.

To make things worse I have also been getting left/right headaches, left ear ache, left sided head scalp numbness and dizziness from time to time in the last 2 months. Just 2 weeks ago I developed a ringing tone in my right ear which is hypersensitive to sounds. I am a total mess.

The mental depression has been really bad and I have been isolated at home because I am unable to enjoy life like I used to.

Recently when I sit and lie down I feel numbness in my legs and feet. When I stand the problems seems to disappear.

My main frustration is the lack of answers and solutions to fix these problems and two specialists can't agree on a course of action.

I have been doing a lot of research and learned that referred pain can be caused by pressure on neck functional nerves and by facet joints sensory nerves but I don't which one is the culprit. Not even the specialists know.

I am worried that if the compression is not removed in time from those nerves (assuming that it is nerve related) I may get a neuropathy and get paralysis.

My bladder/kidney/liver functions are currently fine.

I don't know if anyone in the Mayo community has come across this and knows something about it.

While searching I found this site which looks promising:
spineconnection org
They can fix a lot of spine related problems.

I haven't received the December MRIs/Bone Scan yet.

Thanks and regards

Alfred

Shared files

summary of mri xray (summary-of-mri-xray.pdf)

Interested in more discussions like this? Go to the Spine Health Support Group.

@ab6540183

Hi jm1,

how are you?

Thank you for your support.

Yes I am repetitive by default, I can be somehow annoying at times.

I won't be able to see the second pain management doctor until the 6th of April.

I haven't been taking the meds during the day because the pain management doctor told me to take them at night. It was me that decided to take the extra pregabalin in the last 3 days because I wasn't coping. After taking them I started feeling nausea and feeling extra hot inside my body.

The biggest problem that I have at the moment on top of my existing issues, is managing the anxiety. I find it truly hard to do meditation, doing slow breathing especially after taking the meds, I am feeling short of breath most of the times.

I mentioned the lumps because the pain, the burning start from these lumps and spread downwards. If I hardly touch the right trap muscle I feel very deep pain there.

Best regards

Alfred

Jump to this post

@ab6540183

Alfred, You may want to ask your doctor or pharmacist is the extra doses of pregabalin would be safe, and if that could be causing the nausea and feeling of "being hot" that you describe.

I also saw a post from another member that mentioned a podcast with a psychologist about the psychology of pain and gaining control of it. I looked her up, and here is her website, She has written some books that may interest you. I have not seen this, but I think that this may explain
how meditation, music, relaxation therapies can help reduce pain and why it works among other things. If you understand why it can work, perhaps you can let yourself explore that possibility.

https://www.zoffness.com/

When you describe yourself being short of breath, that may be from breathing improperly by taking quick breaths with the upper part of the lungs and even using neck muscles to do it pulling on the upper ribs. That will cause more anxiety. Relaxed breathing is from the diaphragm muscles in the belly. You can place your hand there to make sure your belly is rising slowly with a slow deep inhale. Don't rush or it gets right back to breathing with your neck again.

@jm1 is correct in that the more you describe yourself as being defeated by your pain and situation, the deeper that gets and you begin to define yourself in a negative way. You can talk yourself into staying there if you keep revisiting those thoughts. It may be subconscious, but you need to find a way to interrupt that roller coaster of pain, fear, and anger.

Perhaps you're not ready to understand and explore this just yet. In order to move forward, there needs to be acceptance of the situation, and in a way, "making friends" with your pain and trying to understand it. Only then, will pain no longer be an enemy, and you can find a way to influence the pain and lessen its anxiety. Those are steps that you can take when you are ready to take responsibility for your wellness.

Alfred, it makes me sad to know that you are suffering and not getting the help that you need. I feel powerless to help, but I am listening.

Jennifer

REPLY
@jenniferhunter

@ab6540183

Alfred, You may want to ask your doctor or pharmacist is the extra doses of pregabalin would be safe, and if that could be causing the nausea and feeling of "being hot" that you describe.

I also saw a post from another member that mentioned a podcast with a psychologist about the psychology of pain and gaining control of it. I looked her up, and here is her website, She has written some books that may interest you. I have not seen this, but I think that this may explain
how meditation, music, relaxation therapies can help reduce pain and why it works among other things. If you understand why it can work, perhaps you can let yourself explore that possibility.

https://www.zoffness.com/

When you describe yourself being short of breath, that may be from breathing improperly by taking quick breaths with the upper part of the lungs and even using neck muscles to do it pulling on the upper ribs. That will cause more anxiety. Relaxed breathing is from the diaphragm muscles in the belly. You can place your hand there to make sure your belly is rising slowly with a slow deep inhale. Don't rush or it gets right back to breathing with your neck again.

@jm1 is correct in that the more you describe yourself as being defeated by your pain and situation, the deeper that gets and you begin to define yourself in a negative way. You can talk yourself into staying there if you keep revisiting those thoughts. It may be subconscious, but you need to find a way to interrupt that roller coaster of pain, fear, and anger.

Perhaps you're not ready to understand and explore this just yet. In order to move forward, there needs to be acceptance of the situation, and in a way, "making friends" with your pain and trying to understand it. Only then, will pain no longer be an enemy, and you can find a way to influence the pain and lessen its anxiety. Those are steps that you can take when you are ready to take responsibility for your wellness.

Alfred, it makes me sad to know that you are suffering and not getting the help that you need. I feel powerless to help, but I am listening.

Jennifer

Jump to this post

Hi Jennifer,

I have been trying to do the meditation stuff but the pain is so extreme and burning which is overwhelming.

For example last night the pain has been getting worse on my left hand side. It is burning, feels numb, deep in my neck, spreading everywhere.

Recently I am getting sore throat from the cervicogenic pain , sharp headaches etc.

How am I going to manage all this pain? The drugs aren't working properly.
As I said I am feeling very drowsy but feeling the full impact of the pain.

My blood pressure reached 167/105 last night. There isn't a single second to relax.
I am under continuous attack. I have been crying from it a lot.

The pain doctor should revise the drugs and try other ones in my opinion.

Next Wednesday, and I hope I can get there, I will have a transforaminal C6 left nerve root steroid injection at Olympic Park Imaging. I asked to be sedated prior because I am not able to lie down due to the pain. I am also experiencing an intermittent electric current starting in the right of my neck flowing towards the shoulder and right arm. My neck muscles are also inflamed. If I touch the skin of my neck it hurts to the touch.

In the end I called virtual emergency ( vved.org.au) instead of calling the ambulance.
The online doctor tweaked my medication a bit by adding an extra tablet of Amitriptyline.
This provided some short term relief, about 2 hours sleep. When I woke up I was still burning in the left. The online doctor advised to get remedial massage.

To feel like this every day and night is very challenging even for the strongest person.

I am wondering if this is life threatening if something is not down soon. It is important that I manage this pain properly because while I am in pain I am stressing my family when they seem me on the floor agonizing.

Thank you.

Best regards

Alfred

REPLY
@jenatsky

Your MRI report shows you have nerves being pinched where they exit your spine running to your various body parts. This is why you are having so much discomfort and moving your neck most likely elicited pain. It’s a double ended sword in that moving your head and neck causes discomfort but keeping your head in one stationary position for a set period also can cause discomfort too when you do go to move it. This is what I’m currently going thru but mine is minor compared to you. Can you face time or zoom your friends instead of Clancy car travel? Clarify one thing for me, you said you went to a chiropractor and many of these symptoms started following that visit? Have you shown the chiropractor your MRI report or the films? I’m surprised anyone even adjusted your neck with an MRI such as yours.

Jump to this post

It wasn't a chiropractor but an osteopath.

I definitely showed him the MR reports for cervical and thoracic and also told home to be gentle because I was inflamed. I told him about the imaging but he replied that the report was good enough.

I can only remember 2 things before this pain exploded:
1) I saw an acupuncturist on 23/2/2023
2) I visited the osteopath on 24/2/2023

After this hell broke loose.
I should have know better with such an MRI.

I didn't even receive a call from my pain management doctor to advise me to avoid manipulation.
He had the full imaging and he should reviewed straight after being taken.

I am not accusing anyone but I noticed this change after being worked on.

I realised that there aren't many real friends because no one calls me except when they have a computer issue to resolve. I haven't received any visits from friends and family except for my second son. Wen I call to have a chat no one answers or returns calls.

I have been an IT admin for over 30 years and still know my stuff.

Now I have burning pain that won't stop for a second.

REPLY

Alfred if you had to put a finger on it it would appear one of both of your health related visits on that day are partially responsible for part of your suffering or exacerbating it. The more you baby your neck the better off you will be. The less stress you put on your neck the better. Please be careful on your pain meds so you don’t accidentally OD since you’re having difficulties getting relief.

REPLY

No massage., too inflammed!
ICE, ICE ICE, only thing to bring relief at this point. keep rotating ice packs.
I have 4 ice packs in my freezer. Elasto gel work good, see lic. They deep cool.

REPLY
@jenatsky

Alfred if you had to put a finger on it it would appear one of both of your health related visits on that day are partially responsible for part of your suffering or exacerbating it. The more you baby your neck the better off you will be. The less stress you put on your neck the better. Please be careful on your pain meds so you don’t accidentally OD since you’re having difficulties getting relief.

Jump to this post

Thanks Jenatsky.

I have to find a way to manage my pain though because I am unable to sleep and sleep is very important for body repair.

If my pain management doctor can't work it out then I am really in big trouble.
There must be a combination of meds that won't nauseate me and also provide relief.

Whenever the ambulance came down, they just improvised by telling me take extra pills.
The ambulance here in Melbourne does not deem incredibly excruciating pain as an an emergency. They will take you to the hospital only if you have a heart attack, a stroke, a car accident or a vax adverse reaction. It really sucks.

Read this below about our hospital system crisis in Australia :

Urgent action needed now on crisis-ridden hospitals
https://www.ama.com.au/ama-rounds/3-march-2023/articles/urgent-action-needed-now-crisis-ridden-hospitals

REPLY

I read the attachment you included. WOW your health system is in deep trouble. Are there any private hospitals. I have no idea how your systems or health insurance works down under. I am very versed in our systems here. You appear to be in limbo and more reason to take care of yourself. Are you still working or on disability?

REPLY
@jenatsky

I read the attachment you included. WOW your health system is in deep trouble. Are there any private hospitals. I have no idea how your systems or health insurance works down under. I am very versed in our systems here. You appear to be in limbo and more reason to take care of yourself. Are you still working or on disability?

Jump to this post

Hi Jenatsky,

this is a real problem.

We have private hospitals here but you need private health insurance.

Unfortunately last year when this problem started I didn't have private health insurance because there were the public hospitals which are free for residents. So I thought that I would go to the public hospital in order to be treated. I soon found out that they are always packed and there is a minimum of 3 year to wait for any orthoapedic and neurosurgery.

In December 2022 I signed up for private hospital cover that costs me $230 Australian dollars per month which is a lot for me that I am not working. I have been providing medical exemption certificates to get government assistance to get by. Here they pay you around $1200 per month, it is not a lot but is better than nothing. On May 7, I will be eligible for the old age pension.

The problem with my new private health insurance is that there is a waiting period of 12 months for pre-existing conditions before they pay anything. Therefore if I go to private hospital they would accept me, but I would have to pay out of my own pocket. I wouldn't have enough money to cover the private hospital which would be very expensive.

But with my case I have the Transport Accident Insurer that would pay for the private hospital. I don't know how to get hospitalized because I would have to request for an approval of private hospital expenses by the private insurer.

Jenatsky, having been a professional nurse for many years, why do I feel a constant excruciating stabbing pain around the left of my cervical spine between C7 and T3 vertebrae roughly, then to the left between SCM and Trapezius muscles at the same level?

How can I relieve that stabbing pain? Is the stabbing pain caused by nerve, muscles or both?

Can a gentle remedial massage help?

The stab started 2 weeks ago on both sides and it is unbearable. If I could get rid of that, I would be much better. The left is much more painful.

Thanks.

Alfred

REPLY

Alfred my first name is Jules. Your trapezius muscles are fed by nerves from C3-4 vertebrae and in part your MRI shows the following
“ C3/C4:
Minimal broad base central and bilateral lateral disc bulging with
associated minimal right intervertebral foramina stenosis
C4/C5:
Broad-based central and right lateral disc bulging with associated
moderate right intervertebral foraminal stenosis
C5/C6:
Disc bulging resulting in moderate bilateral intervertebral foraminal
stenosis
C6/C7:
Right lateral/foraminal disc bulging resulting in moderate right
intervertebral foramina stenosis

C7/T1:
[No protuberant osteophyte, disc bulging, spinal canal stenosis or
neural foramina stenosis.]
Conclusion:
Multilevel disc bulging and multilevel intervertebral foraminal stenosis.
Notice all the mention of stenosis for each segment. This stenosis is compressing on the nerves feeding your painful areas. These can be opened with surgery to provide relief.

REPLY
@jenatsky

Alfred my first name is Jules. Your trapezius muscles are fed by nerves from C3-4 vertebrae and in part your MRI shows the following
“ C3/C4:
Minimal broad base central and bilateral lateral disc bulging with
associated minimal right intervertebral foramina stenosis
C4/C5:
Broad-based central and right lateral disc bulging with associated
moderate right intervertebral foraminal stenosis
C5/C6:
Disc bulging resulting in moderate bilateral intervertebral foraminal
stenosis
C6/C7:
Right lateral/foraminal disc bulging resulting in moderate right
intervertebral foramina stenosis

C7/T1:
[No protuberant osteophyte, disc bulging, spinal canal stenosis or
neural foramina stenosis.]
Conclusion:
Multilevel disc bulging and multilevel intervertebral foraminal stenosis.
Notice all the mention of stenosis for each segment. This stenosis is compressing on the nerves feeding your painful areas. These can be opened with surgery to provide relief.

Jump to this post

Thanks Jules.

But while I am waiting I am feeling a massive burning sensation around from c7/t1 area. I am not really sure if the pain is really coming from there but that is where there is a lump that hurts continually and bad.

None of the medications are fully managing the psin like before.
When that spot hurts I also feel referred pain in my left trap, shoulder, arm, palm, thumb, index finger, middle, 4th and 5th intermittently.
I am not sure how I am going to cope over the next month until I see the new pain management doctor. Next week I will have the C6 steroid injection. There will many other injections I believe until the points of pain will be identified.

REPLY
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