ADT, maybe not? Anyone opted out of ADT?

@wwsmith I agree that my RO is likely an outlier, but that doesn’t mean he’s wrong. Your experience with ROs telling you 6 months, 1 year, or 2 years illustrates the fact that there is some uncertainty even amongst these “experts”. Now that I’m receiving treatment for a newly diagnosed heart condition, I’m especially glad that I had no ADT which can increase heart risks.

There was no uncertainty amongst them all about the need for ADT on a 3+4 case with a high Decipher score. The uncertainty was just about how much ADT time was optimal.

@jime51 that's an interesting question, is exercise and weight training recommended to those on ADT? I mean, just thinking about it, it's never good to just laze around, but with zero testosterone it's going to take some serious discipline to keep at it and I have to wonder at the results - could it result in raising testosterone, even a little, and would that be good or bad?

@carbcounter
Exercise and weight training is essential if you are on ADT. It can alleviate some of the fatigue that people have. They’ll be very tired and do some exercise and find it gives more energy. It’s not going to raise your testosterone while you’re on ADT, the ADT controls it. I get my testosterone checked every month. It’s always under five..

I’ve been on it eight years and run a mile twice a day and go to the gym three times a week and do weight exercises for my arms and legs pretty continuously while I’m there. Do 60 to 70 sit-ups which does help keep the stomach muscles tighter.

I started going to the gym when I found I could not get off the floor without propping myself up on something pulling myself up with my arms. I can now get off the floor without assistance.

@carbcounter I understand that on ADT it’s possible to lose 30% of your muscle mass without exercise. Weight training seems to be key. Dr. Newton spoke at a November pcri.org conference (YouTube) and listed six basic exercises which I am including on my twice weekly gym days. MWF I have a 90 min. exercise routine at home.

@jime51 thanks.
I see there's a previous message posted here on the topic:
https://connect.mayoclinic.org/discussion/weight-lifting-and-adt/
I remain somewhat skeptical.
Perhaps extensive exercise will slow muscle loss but build it back, without testosterone? SMH. Built strength, possibly, but muscle mass?
On older men who already have a hard time with this even without ADT?
And who are short of energy generally because of ADT?

Still I have no doubt that it's best policy to at least try and do what you can. Sitting around and snoozing can only make it worse.

@carbcounter
I was 77 when I started going to the gym three times a week because I couldn’t get off the floor without pulling myself up on something. I had been on ADT for eight years. After four or five months, I had no problem getting off the floor on my own. I know I built up some muscle because I started using heavier weights for my arm and legs. The weights I originally started using weren’t heavy enough, and I could still do the same number of reps with the heavier weights. Didn’t go up a lot, but it went up.

My testosterone was less than five during this time.

@carbcounter All I can say is that when I reduced exercise, I felt like “death warmed over,” and by adding weight training and some moderately vigorous exercise, I have better energy for at least a few hours daily. At nighttime, I’m exhausted regardless.

@jime51
After 8 years of ADT I still don’t feel much fatigue.

I go to sleep A little after midnight every night And wake about 6:15 to 6:30 in the morning. I occasionally have fatigue in the afternoon and take a 25 minute nap. That keeps me up till midnight or later even on the days I feel thar need for a nap.

I do run a mile on the track twice a day even on the three days I go to the gym. I drink 16 ounces of electrolytes almost every morning. That enabled me to build up the stamina to run the track without stopping.

It looks like everybody’s different when it comes to their reaction to ADT.

@jime51 , @jeffmark
Thanks.
I'll forward this to my friend.
He used to be something of a runner but with his current leg pains he's going to have to carefully work up to it.
(frankly I think he needs to suspend the Orgovyx and is being somewhat overtreated for his severity, I thought that from the start and all these discussions here over the last weeks have pretty much confirmed it)
He's also never been much of a gym rat, afaik. I was for some years, never was that much for running, neither ankles nor knees seemed happy with it, LOL. I think I walk more now than I ever ran before. OTOH I used to bicycle a fair amount, until increasing age and increasing traffic talked me out of it.

FWIW he gets more exercise trying to keep his trees and garden trimmed but has complained for months now about lacking the energy for it.