No testosterone on Lupron, can I build muscle strength by working out?

72/73 RP Aug 2022; immediate BCR @ .19; salvage tx 4 mos ADT Orgovyx together with 38 rad sessions; now 3 mos post Orgovyx.
I continued my 45 - 50 min walking almost daily, with an average of 2 upper body light free weight lifting weekly (15 & 25 lb dumbells biceps, triceps, shoulders & chest).
Challenging, but doable, and I was able to maintain my lifting at pre ADT tx level, and at the 3 mos post tx mark, my walking is 90% and lifting is at the same level as pre tx.
Hang in there and fight thru the fatigue.
Everyone seems to react the same, and differently, to ADT.
Best wishes.

I'm on Orgovyx for 14 mos now, Maintaining for me is challenging enough, gains are difficult at best....I feel at this point I have started to make slight gains, but I was fairly strong for my weight before all this and no where near that level any longer.
I try to work out 4 days a week and run 2 miles with each workout. So far so good..
"Hang in there and fight thru the fatigue." is the best advise I can offer as well. It makes me feel a LOT better to work out. When I take a short break to travel or work gets in the way, I feel much worse.

Classic Lupron after effects. Yes - work out and you should reap the benefits.

I am on Orgovyx for 13 months. I work out every other day, and take care of 9 homes with yard work and landscaping. It isn't easy, and it seems you have to keep on the schedule. I definitely feel better if I do my activities. So far, biggest issue is severe hand pain. Not sure if it's from the orgovyx or? I have not gained any weight, but do not have as much strength as before treatment, but feel I am maintaining now.

I guess that depends upon how you define build...I'm on Orgovyx this go around for 12 months (see attached clinical history).

During a typical week, assuming the weather cooperates, my exercise looks like this.

2-3 times a week - outdoor bike ride 25-30 miles each time.
4-5 times a week - gym:
45 minutes on indoor bike
Weights
1000 meter swim.

My weight jumped initially from 191 (I'm 6-3) to 199. I've stabilized it and even got it back to 196.

As others have said, I feel better when I'm able to exercise though the fatigue is still noticeable.

Kevin

Forgot to attach my clinical history!

Hello to everyone,
One simple fact remains: Any and all men MUST have sufficient levels of TESTOSTERONE in their body to maintain good health and overall well-being.
Obviously, LUPRON and other drug therapies like it are designed to reduce and delete as much Testosterone from your body as they can. Of course, the above is predicated on the fact that Testosterone will feed the living and growing cancer cells.
Actually, there remains some uncertainty about how much Testosterone or at what levels of Total and Free Testosterone will actually feed and increase the growing of cancer cells.
As a result, one is placed in a dilemma. If I need a certain amount of “T” to maintain good health and well-being, how much is too much of a reduction of it through LUPRON and other therapies that are trying to accomplish the exact opposite thing then maintaining an appropriate level of “T” in the body?
I had been on “TRT,”Testosterone Replacement Therapy for 12 years before I had to stop in order to prepare for my Radical Prostatectomy. Of course, once you’ve been diagnosed with cancer, you must stop with your “TRT” because you don’t want it to feed the current and present cancer cells.
Every patient is different and there are a lot of considerations that go into making the ultimate choice of surgery versus radiation to treat your Prostate Cancer.
I just turned 69 years old and have been severely debilitated from CSF/ME, FIBROMYALGIA and had surgery to correct my CHIARI MALFORMATION back in 2001.
Without being on my “TRT,” my Total “T” is between 20-90 when the normal range for men 50+ years in age is about 250/300 to 700/800. Some scales of measurement are different but the above are good ranges for this conversation.
I literally don’t have a life nor can I function with my “T” levels that low while already dealing with severe and debilitating symptoms of the disease states I previously mentioned. For those and other reasons, I chose the Radical Prostatectomy over Radiation.
Taking Lupron and following the protocols associated with it were by far the worst choice for me personally.
The 6 months I had to discontinue my “TRT” were awful and horribly limited my ability to function day to day. If I don’t maintain an average of about 450 to 550 of Total “T” I don’t have a life to live other than exacerbating my already debilitating symptoms and being mostly bedridden and home confined. If I am really not “living a life” while alive, what’s the point? I’ve already and continue to experience 32 years of severe, life altering debilitation.
The point I am making is that there is no “Right Answer!”
Some men can continue to function okay or alright while on LUPRON and others experience a measurable loss of energy and overall strength, endurance and well-being.
Based on the above, you can understand that there isn’t much chance or opportunity for somebody on LUPRON to work out or increase their exercise program if their Testosterone levels are insufficient. Realizing of course that different men will react differently to below average “T” levels or even worse.
The only observation you can assess for certain is that you feel better and stronger or you don’t, regardless of which medical protocol(s) you’re following.
After many years of accepting insufficient and inaccurate information with very little research underlying it, physicians and surgeons were very reluctant to place a former Prostate Cancer Patient back on “TRT.” However, today’s considerably increased research and more numerous patient studies have “debunked” the old, out of date “T” controversies.
In FACT: Many surgeons and physicians are placing men on “TRT” to assist them with their recovery following a Radical Prostatectomy.
In my own particular case and others. If there is and remains no more Prostate Cancer due to having the Prostate removed and no more perceptible PSA, ( mine being and remaining for the first 11 months after surgery at < 0.014). Then essentially, I have the same numbers and perceivable markers as a man who never had Prostate Cancer.
As one doctor wrote and was quoted as saying, “If we prescribe “TRT” for men who suffer from Hypogonadism under the assumptions of it being alright with only the possible side effects of most other treatment protocols, remedies etc, why would we tell or treat a man who no longer has any detectable Prostate cancer in his body or detectable PSA differently by telling him he has a higher risk into recurring cancer as the man who’s never had cancer? By far, there’s a greater number of men getting Prostate Cancer that have never been on “TRT” than those that have. Continuing the above thought and strategy of continuing “TRT” after achieving remission. Why prevent a man in remission from having access to or returning to “TRT?”
Regardless of any post surgery or radiation treatments that render a man into remission with no detectable traces of cancer, there’s still a 30%-40% chance that their Prostate Cancer will come back or return within or up to the first 5 years following his initial treatments and following remission.
The FACT remains clear to us all. One is never totally cured of Prostate Cancer. You either remain in remission or you don’t! Like all patients, if our cancer returns we will address it then and at that point assess and determine what kind of treatments to utilize to eradicate it again.
In the end, we can only do the best we can to manifest the best overall health and well-being we can in order to live and enjoy the best quality of life that we can.
GODSPEED to us all

I've often wondered about the discussion of testosterone levels in men who come off treatment. In my case, we stopped triplet therapy in May 18 with the last Lupron 90 day shot.

By October my T was 135, by February 19 it was 400+. When my PCa finally returned in April this year, almost 4-1/2 years since the last Lupron shot, it was 600+.

Mine is a pretty aggressive cancer so in theory with the return of T it should have started growing much sooner than it did.

I think the evidence is pretty clear that castration can have an affect on PSA.. I am not so sure that when you stop treatment that having T rise is equivalent to adding fuel to the fire.

Thanks for your reply. I’ve done a lot of research in the area of “TRT” and its effects on stimulating or not, the return of Prostate Cancer. First and foremost, there won’t be enough studies or patient cohorts done to significantly prove this one way or another for the simple reason that number of patients like me who were already on “TRT”, had surgery and then resumed their “TRT” following surgery just don’t exist!
The fact that every person’s body reacts differently to many therapies, including “TRT” is another challenge. Even I am having to recalculate the amount of “T” to take following my surgery because my body is different and has changed as a result of my previous Prostate Cancer and surgery. However, as a stated before, living my life without “TRT” is not living it becomes simply surviving on the lowest level of human existence possible. I already did that for 20+ years of my life and I will not return to living, I should say, “merely existing” again at that inhumane level of life. Everybody has to make personal that are the best for them based on their life experience and current level of existence going forward. I am very clear about what my levels are and I intend to live whatever time I have left on this earth true to that and remain integral to my core briefs.

Hello there again. It was such a huge part of my post surgical recovery and additional adverse symptom associated with my “RALP,” and I forgot to previously mention it!
When I was totally off of “TRT” I had absolutely “ZERO” LIBIDO at all. I had been off “TRT” about 3+ weeks prior to my surgery. Normally, only being off of “TRT” for that long wouldn’t have any effect on my Libido.
Given that I had taken my last regular “T” injection on 10/3/22, that would have been within my normal every 2 week injection schedule to take another injection on 10/17/22, which I did not. So realistically, I was only about 1 week short of my normal “TRT” regiment when I had my surgery in 10/25/22. My wife and I enjoyed 2 wonderful nights of romance and sex the 2 nights prior to my surgery. My Libido was strong along with my sex drive and keen desire for my wife.
The day following my surgery, any and all Libido immediately disappeared and would remain that way for the next 5+ months. I didn’t have one scintilla of desire for sex or anything like it.
When I resumed my “TRT” in the last week of March, 2022, my Libido and sex drive returned immediately.
Of course, a great deal of my Libido loss can be directly the result of my surgery and it was. However, as the months rolled on I was still experiencing ZERO” Libido and sex drive until I resumed my “TRT!”
Now the immediate problem was my level of Incontinence and ED. The Incontinence cleared up almost back to normal 5 months following my surgery. However, my ED is still a concern after 11 months following my surgery. My Libido and desire are back but my Penis can only achieve about 60% of a normal erection and that isn’t strong enough for an erection to have penetration. So, as I had discussed in my prior article, I’ve gone to TRIMIX injections and those has solved the inadequate erection problems. However, I mainly wanted to discuss the loss of Libido as it is directly related to LUPRON THERAPY. I don’t know how much the radiation treatments cause because I’ve never had them. However, speaking for myself, I could never take LUPRON and loose all my physical and mental strength along with my Libido. It would just be too much. Hence, I chose the surgery. Importantly, if my cancer ever returns, I do have the radiation option available where you do not have it if you selected radiation first as your primary treatment protocol to eradicate your prostate Cancer. Just wanting to be as transparent and as informative as I can be.
Best wishes to all of you,
GODSPEED