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Met with dietician today: Some answers to questions the group asked
I met today with a dietitian who specializes in cancer survivorship nutrition. Here’s how that went:
We met for about an hour, just a telephone visit. I had a couple of specific questions, and was happy to hear him provide immediate, detailed responses tailored to prostate cancer - you know how sometimes you’ll talk to an “expert” and you’ll be able to work out pretty quickly that they’re a generalist giving you a general answer with a lot of extra words to pad their response out so they sound like they know more than they do? That wasn’t this guy, he gave very precise answers to my questions. That made me feel confident in talking with him.
Onto the food:
I asked about eggs, because there are a lot of controversy around eggs and prostate cancer.
The dietician talked about the pros and cons about eggs in relation to prostate cancer, then stated the position of the nutritional department at the cancer center is that eggs don’t need to be severely limited, just moderated - no more than two a day. Since I rarely have more than four eggs a week these days, I’m good, but now I feel ok in increasing that a little, maybe up to six eggs a week.
I also asked if there were any foods that were recommended to never consume. I said, “What’s the cigarette of the food world?”
“Two things,” he replied, “Alcohol and deli meats/cured meats. I’m all about moderation in all things, but for those two things, if you don’t have to consume them, then don’t.”
That means hotdogs, bologna, bacon, sausage, salami, even so-called healthy sliced meats, like chicken or turkey from the deli, are an avoid-at-all-costs if possible.
I was surprised by the chicken and turkey stuff, but he said those are processed in such a way to prepare them for deli sales, that it makes them unsuitable for a cancer survivorship diet. That also includes nitrate/nitrite-free stuff and chicken sausages.
Thankfully, he did ok making some of that stuff at home, including roast beef, which would still count against the recommended red meat amounts, but would be better for me than buying the pre-sliced stuff.
That one hurts a little because deli meats and cured meats made up a very large part of my diet. I had some form of that every day, and many times multiple times a day, and have done so since I was old enough to eat solid food (maybe that’s why I developed cancer 😉). I ate obscene amounts of lunchmeats, bacon, and sausages.
So that was the worst of it. With the alcohol, he just said if I don’t feel like I have to drink, then don’t, but recognized that there’s a social component to it that’s hard to fight. I mentioned that I didn’t drink a lot beforehand, and I’m not drinking at all right now, and he simply recommended not starting back again if I could help it.
He then went through the usual things of this much red meat, that much protein, eat a plant-forward diet, eat the rainbow, blah blah blah, but did specifically point out that tomatoes appear to be very effective in curtailing prostate cancer recurrence, so eat tomatoes, fresh, canned, or cooked, as much as possible.
Then he had me tell him typical meals that we eat, three of each of breakfast, lunch, and supper, as well as snacks and desserts, and he graded me very highly on my choices overall, with little tweaks here and there. He said I was eating better than 95% of the people he meets with, and he commended me on my general food/meal knowledge…we even swapped a couple of recipe ideas.
Last thing he left me with was that he was sending me a bunch of dietary info through my patient portal, and that I had access to nutrition services through the care center for the rest of my “very long life,” and “…one more thing: holidays and vacations, throw all that out the window and eat and drink what you want. Life’s too short not to have a little fun.”
All in all, a good meeting, I thought.
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Thanks for sharing. Sounds all pretty common sense. Alcohol and cured meats have been singled out by the WHO as promiting cancer (in my case, zero alcohol is an impossibility, but I would have no problem
with going vegetarian- which I almost am).
Did you meet the dietician on your own initiative or were you directed to him? No one in my care team talked about that. Are you in a high recurrence risk group?
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2 ReactionsThe chicken and turkey I eat are all bought raw by my wife and cooked in our oven. You don’t want it fried, though it really taste good that way.
I had a turkey thigh last night. She bakes it with a little seasoning and they taste great. They’re really big but only take 40 minutes to cook, about the same as chicken.
You don’t mention anything about dairy. Did you ask him about milk, cheese or butter?
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1 Reaction@topf - I suppose it was a little of both in the way the appointment happened. The cancer center gave me a packet of some info when I was first diagnosed, talking about various services and support available to cancer patients, and one of those mentioned having access to cancer-specific nutritionists.
I kept that in the back of my mind, until recently, then mentioned it during my 6-month follow-up, and the NP set it up for me.
@jeffmarc - I didn’t ask about dairy, no. As far as butter, he did mention that I should favor olive oil and avocado oil over butter. We didn’t talk much about cheese or milk, but at one point, he did say that (apart from the deli & cured meats), nothing was strictly off-limits, but to just practice moderation.
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1 ReactionThe way I’ve heard it summarized - and this is pretty much in line with all that you mentioned from your visit with the nutritionist - is that “heart-healthy is prostate-healthy.” Since we’re inundated with information about “heart-healthy diets,” it’s a concept that’s easy to grasp.
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Other foods you and others mentioned:
> meats: I’ve read that as long as they’re lean meats it’s ok (and everything in moderation).
> oils - avocado oil and extra virgin olive oil are good; highly refined industrial seed and vegetable oils are bad.
> tomatoes: It’s the Lycopene in the tomatoes that appear to be very effective in curtailing prostate cancer recurrence. But be aware how you prepare it and what you eat it with. Also, the studies are mixed on the benefits of Lycopene supplements’ effectiveness in curtailing prostate cancer recurrence.
Our bodies need a balance of proteins, fats, and carbohydrates. If avoiding too much, supplements will be needed.
I would not attribute my prostate cancer to the “deli meats and cured meats that made up a very large part of my diet.” With all the environmental toxins that we’re exposed to on a daily basis (as well as the industrial solvents - like trichloroethylene - that I was exposed to on a daily basis while in the military), it’s just as likely as not that the cause is there.
I was a meat and potatoes guy growing up and through adulthood, so I was cautious about changing to a diet that I wasn’t going to maintain —> I decreased red meats; increased fish, salads; added more fruits, vegetables, and grains/nuts; cut out soft drinks; cut back on processed foods, and made other tweaks here and there. (Still, I do have a beer, burger, or a donut once in a while.)
(Added to all that is exercise - both load-bearing and cardio; I engage in one or the other daily. Again, heart-healthy is prostate-healthy.)
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3 ReactionsRed meats…he recommended limiting those to 18oz a week, which isn’t that hard to do for me.
Oils…specifically avoid vegetable oil and canola oil. I already do that, as I find canola oil has a fishy smell and taste.
Tomatoes…that one was an “eat as much as you can” item, but I’ll have to go back and see if I wrote it down, because there’s something you’re supposed to eat with them to help with absorption of the lycopene (fat, maybe?).
He did touch on exercise. I got high marks for my cardio, briskly walking 2.5 miles daily, but I don’t do any strength/resistance training - I got marked down for that.
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1 ReactionWOW!! Like, for real??You even mentioned the word ‘moderation’ a few times in that post…and how many eggs per week??!!
No, no sorry - this guy is obviously a fool, just giving you boilerplate answers. It simply HAS TO BE much more complicated than that!
🤣🤣🤣
Thanks for a great post - you made my frickin day!🤗
Phil
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1 Reaction@turtbean “…but just to practice moderation.”
BLASPHEMY!!!
Thanks for sharing all of the information that you got 😃 !
As Brian said all that is healthy for heart is healthy for body in general and once more troubling items were confirmed. 👍 I am glad that he also mentioned Canola oil since it is "invented" product, there is no such thing as Canola plant or seed - it is combination of the 2 words - Canada and oil . It was originally industrial product for keeping machines oiled etc. and than with ultra-processing "edible" oil was made (grosss) anyhow - I never even ventured in mentioning that here since taking off one more item from the "table" might cause some people have premature "departure" from this realm 🤪.
In regard to Lycopen - yes, it is more easily absorbed when tomatoes are cooked with some oil , which is always the case anyways . : )))
Keep up with healthy changes : ))), it will help in the long run in many ways than one : ))) !
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1 Reaction@turtbean
The deal with tomatoes is that you have to eat them cooked. Apparently, the uncooked tomatoes don’t provide nearly as much benefits.
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3 Reactions@jeffmarc
Yes, cooking tomatoes with some oil helps absorption by 2 to 4 times. However eating raw tomatoes with olive oil dressing also somewhat helps absorption, but cooking is the best. Tomato in any shape or form is healthy for different reasons. Adding tomato juice or tomato paste to food also adds lycopene or adding tomatoes as a side to any roast or sauce or risotto etc etc gives the same benefits. I do not know about "Bloody Mary" though lol (JK ) .
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3 Reactions