Neuropathy: Numbness only, no pain

Posted by John, Volunteer Mentor @johnbishop, Sep 10, 2020

When I was first diagnosed with idiopathic small fiber peripheral neuropathy and numbness was my only symptom, my neurologist told me that I am one of the "lucky" few who didn't also have pain and other associated symptoms of neuropathy. I knew there were others out there but yesterday I met my first member on Connect who has a similar diagnosis. I want to thank that member for joining Mayo Clinic Connect and sending me a private message that I would like to answer here to start this discussion.

Hello @afirefly, Welcome to Connect. You mentioned being diagnosed with large fiber demyelinating predominately sensory peripheral neuropathy at Mayo Clinic. The neurologist's recommendation was exercise and balance exercises. Your symptoms are less than one year and are primarily progressive loss of sensation in your hands and feet. You also said aside from occasional muscle cramps in your calves and dyesthesias in hands and feet, you experience little discomfort. Your greatest concern now is the degree of disability you will have as the numbness progresses.

I can tell you that we think a lot alike. When I walked out of the neurologists office with similar symptoms of just numbness in the feet and lower legs with no pain – and no recommendations for treatment, I was pretty down. I was told to let them know as the condition progressed and my biggest fear at the time was not being able to drive myself. That's when I started doing my own research and found Mayo Clinic Connect after being diagnosed with idiopathic small fiber PN.

You have some really good and thoughtful questions which I will try to answer the best I can.

Question: Although you have improved on the Protocol, did you ever have complete loss of sensation in your feet? I ask because I truly dread the possibility of total sensory loss in my feet.

Answer: I never had a complete loss of sensation in my feet. At the worst, they felt numb and sometimes tingly but not painful, just uncomfortable. They mostly always feel cold and after being diagnosed with lymphedema I have to wear compression socks which doesn't help the numbness feeling. I have noticed that it seems like I've had some feeling returning ever so often when I'm exercising on my crossfit exercise bike. I use it several times a day for 30 to 45 minutes when I can to build up leg and arm strength. I recently purchased a device called a Sand Dune Stepper to work on my balance issues. I do think it helps and I've noticed a little more feeling in the bottom of my feet – if that makes sense for numb feet. Website – https://www.sanddunestepper.com/
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Question: Assuming you have little or no sensation in your toes and the soles of your feet, are you still able to drive a car?
If yes, would you kindly tell me what maneuvers/measures you have used over the years to compensate for the absence of feeling in your feet while driving?

Answer: I am still able to drive a car. The numbness was always a concern in my mind but never kept me from feeling the pressure of placing my feet on the pedals and pushing them down or letting them up.
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Question: Assuming you have little or no sensation in your toes and the soles of your feet, how difficult is it for you to walk? Before my neuropathy, if my foot was in a position too long it would "go to sleep" from lack of circulation to the nerves. The sensation would return seconds later once I changed my foot position. However, I don't believe I would have been able to walk on that sleeping foot until the circulation had been restored. Please tell me if there are/were any maneuvers/measures you have used over the years to compensate for the absence of feeling in your feet while walking.

Answer: When I was in my late 40s, my wife would sometimes tell me that I walk like an old man and now I am one and still walking the same. I've always been slow getting up and slow to take the first steps when walking. I guess I would call it trying to be careful because I wasn't sure of my footing. I think recognizing that your feet may not be as steady is a good thing and keeps you alert when walking. I struggle with walking any distance due to lower back issues. I recently had some physical therapy to learn some back and stomach muscle strengthing exercises which has helped some. Now I just have to execute a plan to do them often.
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Question: You indicated that the cost of the old Protocol was under $10/day (prior to 525 Protocol) several years ago and that the current 525 Protocol is $6.44/day. Does that mean Protocol 525 these days costs somewhat less than the old (original) Protocol?

Answer: Each item in the original protocol lasted a different number of days so the cost was more spread out and roughly calculated at under $10/day. The new 525 Protocol is a 30 day supply for $6.44/day ($193.20). It's also fewer pills to swallow which I really like. The Ramp up version is different due to the R-ALA in the regular 30 day supply. The daily R-ALA dosage is 1200 mg which causes some people to have stomach problems so the ramp up is to gradually increase the dosage to get use to the higher amount. I never had an issue because I was already taking supplements for the PN from my research and was taking that amount of ALA before I found the original protocol. Related discussion — Have you tried the new Protocol 525 product for neuropathy relief?: https://connect.mayoclinic.org/discussion/have-you-tried-the-new-protocol-525-product-for-neuropathy-relief/
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Question: Do you use orthotics or inserts in your shoes? Special shoes?

Answer: I've tried some orthotics and different inserts but don't always use them. I found some felt/wool inserts that I like during the winter time as an extra cushion. I do like Sketchers because of the memory foam cushion and comfort. I used to wear the canvas shell ones but my neurologist told me it would be best to wear shoes with good side support for walking. So, I try to choose slip-ons with good side support made out of leather. There is another discussion on Connect you might find helpful for shoes – If the shoe fits…right?: https://connect.mayoclinic.org/discussion/if-the-shoe-fits-right/
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Question: Besides daily foot exams, lotion to your feet, and avoiding barefoot walking, are there any other measures you use to protect your numb feet?

Answer: For me, this all started with a trip to the ER after waking up one night to go to the bathroom and when reaching the bathroom seeing blood all over the floor and trying to figure out where it's coming from. Surprised was I to see it pumping in a small stream from my ankle. Long story short, I unconciously rubbed my feet during the night and I had a hang nail on my big toe which tore the skin and part of a vein close to the surface. After that episode, I always wear white short loose socks to bed and I apply lotion to my feet and legs to keep them moisturized. I think that also helps with the healing process when you think that there are tiny sensory nerves just under the skin and it helps to keep the skin moist to protect them.

Hope this helps…let me know if I missed anything or if you have any other questions. We have a great group of members with a lot of experience here on Connect.

John

Interested in more discussions like this? Go to the Neuropathy Support Group.

@misfire

Hello,
This is my first post.
A few years ago(2022) I was diagnosed with idiopathic sfn. I have had episodes(I think since 2017). My feet hurt for a year or so, I ignored it and the podiatrist sent me to the neurologist. I passed all my tests. It went from pain to numbness in both my feet. I got used to it. In the past month it has moved from my feet up to my thighs. I am not able to feel pain in my muscles. Stretching, lifting, etc... there is tiredness, pressure, and no pain or much feeling. The numbness is making it slightly hard to walk only because my legs just don't feel right. How long did it take to progress? Are you able to feel stretching etc? I am also looking for any ideas as the neurologist has started all the tests again. " I would be lying if I said I wasn't scared " rang true. I haven't told my family, only my wife who I don't think realizes the seriousness? I'll post more in the my story section. I am also turning 50.

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I am 82; work out 1-2 hours daily...have small fiber neuropathy for 3 years. It has progressed from my feet to thighs. EMG is worse each time BUT I don't have pain. I do have vibrations in legs to feet if my butt is touched or top of thighs is touched. This is very uncomfortable and I am worse at night with heavy legs and also often very cold feet. I have a vague autoimmune diagnosis but the three neurologists (last one Columbia University, NY doc have told me after extensive bloodwork I have no autoimmune causes for the neuropathy. My auto immune disease started ten years ago after contracting an infectious disease in Africa. Was on hydroxchloroquin for years but never had any lupus symtoms; just labs that showed antibodies. Ironically now, my labs are normal except for my ANA. I went off the hydroxy at suggestion of another neuurologist (Medical University of So. Carolina). This was also a great doc who did extensive antibody labs which took 3 mos to get results; all were negative. I have had epidural injections in L4,5 with no results (not surprising). I have had ultrasounds of blood vessels in legs; all normal. My cause is not diabetes, chemo or alcohol and not autoimmune. SO.....after all of my advocacy with the best neurologists, I am left as so many of you...no treatment or cure. I am on a 2 dosage of gabapentin at night and seems to help prevent severe cramping I will often have at night. My doctors tell me I have excellent strength, tendon reflexes and range of motion. I have been advised to do impact exercises which I do almost daily as well as cardio strength and lower body strengthening as well. I am trying to reconcile this disability. It affects my balance but then I am 82. Supplements is a whole other story. B6 is important but not an overdo. I take Magnesium and D3 and HMB. Have no idea if they help. My blood work for vitamins is in normal range. I appreciate a place to tell my story and to hear from other sufferers of this terrible disease. THERE ARE SO MANY OF US!!

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@misfire

Hello,
This is my first post.
A few years ago(2022) I was diagnosed with idiopathic sfn. I have had episodes(I think since 2017). My feet hurt for a year or so, I ignored it and the podiatrist sent me to the neurologist. I passed all my tests. It went from pain to numbness in both my feet. I got used to it. In the past month it has moved from my feet up to my thighs. I am not able to feel pain in my muscles. Stretching, lifting, etc... there is tiredness, pressure, and no pain or much feeling. The numbness is making it slightly hard to walk only because my legs just don't feel right. How long did it take to progress? Are you able to feel stretching etc? I am also looking for any ideas as the neurologist has started all the tests again. " I would be lying if I said I wasn't scared " rang true. I haven't told my family, only my wife who I don't think realizes the seriousness? I'll post more in the my story section. I am also turning 50.

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Placing my feet on a vibrating platform really helped me. LifePro is a company that makes this type of equipment. Available on Amazon.

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I have PN too in my feet. No pain just numb. I have as told by neurologist it is due to my diabetes 2 . Balance and weight walking are challenging. The neurologist wrote a script for pt. I have never been to PT and I am wondering if anyone out there has benefitted from it. I am 77 and worried about mobility also. I bought a lightweight walker and have a cane. I don't use either 100 per cent if the time but I do use them if a lot of walking us required. I understand the person who is scared and whose wife is not aware I f the severity. When I tell people about PN they just look at me with what appears to be no understanding. Hell what do we expect?? Our doctors don't fully understand and they are suppose to be the experts!

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@misfire

Hello,
This is my first post.
A few years ago(2022) I was diagnosed with idiopathic sfn. I have had episodes(I think since 2017). My feet hurt for a year or so, I ignored it and the podiatrist sent me to the neurologist. I passed all my tests. It went from pain to numbness in both my feet. I got used to it. In the past month it has moved from my feet up to my thighs. I am not able to feel pain in my muscles. Stretching, lifting, etc... there is tiredness, pressure, and no pain or much feeling. The numbness is making it slightly hard to walk only because my legs just don't feel right. How long did it take to progress? Are you able to feel stretching etc? I am also looking for any ideas as the neurologist has started all the tests again. " I would be lying if I said I wasn't scared " rang true. I haven't told my family, only my wife who I don't think realizes the seriousness? I'll post more in the my story section. I am also turning 50.

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You are very low in COBALAMIN, B12. Alcohol and or poor diet. Our nerves are coated with a protecting fat called MYELIN. Take METHLCOBALAMIN as it is the most easily absorbed of the 3 types. And stay off the booze. It irritates our 20 ft long intestine, stopping B12 absolution.
Good luck.

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@scain

I have PN too in my feet. No pain just numb. I have as told by neurologist it is due to my diabetes 2 . Balance and weight walking are challenging. The neurologist wrote a script for pt. I have never been to PT and I am wondering if anyone out there has benefitted from it. I am 77 and worried about mobility also. I bought a lightweight walker and have a cane. I don't use either 100 per cent if the time but I do use them if a lot of walking us required. I understand the person who is scared and whose wife is not aware I f the severity. When I tell people about PN they just look at me with what appears to be no understanding. Hell what do we expect?? Our doctors don't fully understand and they are suppose to be the experts!

Jump to this post

I have recently finished a 6 week PT session for balance issues. It was definitely helpful! Go and learn. Whatever you're given, take and carry with you, don't just gloss over it. I'd guess that these exercises have been more help dealing with the PN than just about anything else.

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@mamamarch

I have recently finished a 6 week PT session for balance issues. It was definitely helpful! Go and learn. Whatever you're given, take and carry with you, don't just gloss over it. I'd guess that these exercises have been more help dealing with the PN than just about anything else.

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Thank you for your insight.

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@jamessaxo

You are very low in COBALAMIN, B12. Alcohol and or poor diet. Our nerves are coated with a protecting fat called MYELIN. Take METHLCOBALAMIN as it is the most easily absorbed of the 3 types. And stay off the booze. It irritates our 20 ft long intestine, stopping B12 absolution.
Good luck.

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Not sure what post you are responding to but for the record I don't drink alcohol at all. Never liked the taste of it!

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I wrote " either all " . We need 4.5 micrograms daily of B12. A steak has just that. Older stomach has less acid, so less B12 is extracted from food. Take METHYLCOBALAMIN suppl. or ask doc. for a B12 injection. Try turmeric as I do in addition. Have a non drinking 81 yr old younger brother who only ate pizza . His heart rate was 95 at rest. What's yours. Good luck.

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@sunnyflower

Hello @fiesty76, @johnbishop, I saw this post and just wanted to repeat something I shared some time back that I do not know if you saw.

I once saw a very wise therapist showed me that minimizing my own circumstance was counterproductive to my well-being and mental health.

We all walk through many fires here on Earth in this lifetime. We all have different human endurance thresholds and mental health thresholds.

Most often, while we are thinking someone else's hardships are much worse than our own, they are thinking the same thing; that hours are worse than theirs.

The only thing that works for me is that I know and trust God cares deeply about the details in my/our life/s and that He has a higher purpose in them.

Also knowing and experiencing His ever presence and immeasurable, vast, boundless, sacrificial, unmerrited, deep love for me/us brings me a lot of comfort and His peace through Christ that surpasses all human understanding, Philippians 4:7.

Not to mention the promises we have in eternal life, among which is a new body-Philippians 3:21 and no more tears- Revelation 3:24 ""And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.-" blessed be the Lord... According to all that He promised; not one word has failed of all His good promise" . 1st Kings 8:56. I can't wait!!

I hope you have a special weekend. I care deeply about your well-being. Sunnyflower 😊

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Hank, are you still here? It's been several years since I've been on the blog. Too many health problems; haven't felt well enough. Five hip fractures/3 surgeries 2023, fall 2024 3 more surgeries; 6 on left leg in year and 3 months, 4th spine surgery 1/2025, still can't stand up straight-chronic fractures on 3rd lumbar vertebrae probably responsible, partially torn rotator cuff and two other partially torn tendons same shoulder, and more along w/ family tragedy. I am still walking by faith, Hebrews 11:1 "Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." I have nothing but praise on my lips for our Lord Jesus Who's love is sacrificial, vast, boundless, free. I am deeply grateful for my innumerable blessings and the peace of God through Christ which transcends all understanding Philippians 4:7. Life is so tough but thankfully temporary, but a blink of an eye in light of all eternity. Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father but by Me" John 14:6. Hope all of you all are experience God's presence and peace. Hang on Sisters and Brothers! Sunny Flower

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@sunnyflower

Hank, are you still here? It's been several years since I've been on the blog. Too many health problems; haven't felt well enough. Five hip fractures/3 surgeries 2023, fall 2024 3 more surgeries; 6 on left leg in year and 3 months, 4th spine surgery 1/2025, still can't stand up straight-chronic fractures on 3rd lumbar vertebrae probably responsible, partially torn rotator cuff and two other partially torn tendons same shoulder, and more along w/ family tragedy. I am still walking by faith, Hebrews 11:1 "Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." I have nothing but praise on my lips for our Lord Jesus Who's love is sacrificial, vast, boundless, free. I am deeply grateful for my innumerable blessings and the peace of God through Christ which transcends all understanding Philippians 4:7. Life is so tough but thankfully temporary, but a blink of an eye in light of all eternity. Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes to the Father but by Me" John 14:6. Hope all of you all are experience God's presence and peace. Hang on Sisters and Brothers! Sunny Flower

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Good to see you back on Connect @sunnyflower! I'm not sure Hank @jesfactsmon is still following Connect since he last was active on June 20, 2022. Hopefully he and his wife are doing OK.

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