← Return to Several opinions-collapsed arch, jaw, bite. Osteoporosis Implants

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@loribmt

Good morning, @tmtm4 I’ve taken the past few days to give your post a lot of consideration before replying. Just to clarify, I have a strong dental background but I’m not a dentist so I’m not in a position to offer treatments or tell you to do.
I’d like to help you sort through a few things and narrow your options. I know this is a lot to take in all at once so I think the best way is to break this down into steps and with more than one conversation.
From what you’ve written, you have quite a long history of health, bone and dental concerns. Not having a healthy mouth can cause inflammation and potentially serious health issues in the rest of the body too. So, the goal is to get your mouth healthy again and have a smile return to your face. ☺️

Are you looking to have all your teeth extracted and replaced with dentures? Your current dentist nailed it by saying you’d need to have adhesive (goop) to keep them held in place. However, it is possible and is probably the least expensive option. Generations of grandparents lived that way. The upper would stay in place reasonably well, but the lower denture would have no where to rest solidly, even with adhesive, without a ridge. Do you still have your lower eye teeth? Are they solid? Sometimes those can be used as anchors for a lower denture.

Implants might be the way to go in your case, as I’ll explain further. I know there’s a hesitancy because of the Reclast, osteoporosis and cost. But they might give you a more permanent and fixed dental prosthetic. Implant replacements come in many sizes and options from individual teeth, to full mouth ‘bridges’ (with no palate) to anchors for removable dentures with a palate.
There are different types of implant anchors as well. Mini implants are short, not as long as standard, making them usable in people with diminished jaw bone. They can be used to hold dentures in place. Another option is bone grafting for dental implants if the patient’s bone loss is significant. That’s what’s used in the All on 4 technique.

I think to begin with, talking about bone support in your jaws is a good place to start. Jawbone loss is a common consequence of tooth loss. Physical stimuli such as biting and chewing strengthen the jawbone. Just like weight bearing exercises strengthen our body’s bones. Every time you eat or chew, the biting or chewing force travels through your teeth to the jawbone, stimulating the jawbone to grow and rebuild. After tooth extraction, the jawbone loses its stimuli, causing the jawbone to lose width, height, and volume. After while the upper and lower jaw bones shrink to the point where there is little ridge left on the top for a denture to grip and the lower jaw ridge becomes none existent.

Replacing missing teeth with bridges and dentures won’t solve the problem of bone loss because they don’t transmit the chewing and biting force to the jawbone. Dental implants can prevent jawbone loss because they act like natural teeth roots, and transmit the biting and chewing force directly into the jawbone.

One of the concerns of having dental implants with someone taking bisphosphonates for bone support, such as Reclast, has do with the natural regeneration of bone. Bisphosphonates slow down the deterioration process while reducing bone thinning to a substantial extent.
One concern for discussion is whether or not people who are taking bisphosphonates tend to have a worse prognosis compared to those who are not taking the medication. The reason for this is due to the constant bone renewal process referred to as “bone turnover.” This turnover is only accomplished when the bone has two types of cells – the first type eats up the old bone (osteoclasts) and the second lays new bone in its place (osteoblasts).

Well, because bisphosphonates interfere with the effectiveness of cells that eat up the bone (osteoclasts) it tends to increase bone density. But it isn’t allowing for old bone to be ‘eaten up’ or resorbed. It’s not a natural process of renewal.
Because implants need the bones to heal, the new bone around a newly placed dental implant must be ‘eaten up’ by osteoclasts before new bone can be formed. Because of bisphosphonates, this may be less effective and the area may not heal as well. In some cases, your dentist will recommend a blood test procedure called a serum CTX, which evaluates how your osteoclasts are being affected by Bisphosphonates.

However, you are now on Tymlos, which is another mechanism altogether. It actually allows for both parts of the natural bone building process which, in my opinion, makes you potentially a much better candidate for some implants.

May I ask how your tooth loss journey began? Did you have a history of gum disease/periodontal disease? That is generally how bone support in the mouth begins to fail. How many teeth do you have remaining on each arch that your current dentist feels are solid and could remain?

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Replies to "Good morning, @tmtm4 I’ve taken the past few days to give your post a lot of..."

I have had two teeth pulled a long time ago on top. I do have periodontal disease. Two years ago my dentist wanted to put a bridge on both sides but I hesitated. By 2020 I had lost more teeth on top but in 2020 They started to spontaneously erupt. I needed back, shoulder and foot surgery pretty bad so I asked my dentist what to do first because by then he wanted to pull the rest of my teeth on top and make a denture. He said I could wait. Last year he was making my dentures and had already sent me to the oral surgeon for a plan. I asked him if I could get implants and he said no because I took Reclast for two years. (Last time was early June 2021.) My dentist had already measured my mouth and made part of the denture & sent it off for the first step. When I went in for my second appt he stopped in the middle of measuring and the nurse came into the room and said he would call me. After several days, I called him and asked what was going on. He said I have to go to a prosthodontist. The Pros. said my arch had fell and shows me this denture that he says is mine. He hadn't even looked in my mouth! It was a stock denture and he would see me a couple of weeks after they pull my teeth. Pros 2: Said I could get a denture but must have a pallet. Sent me to another surgeon who said I could get 6 implants for a implant supported denture which would be approx $25,000 + the cost of the Pros2.
Needless to say, I changed my primary dentist and my new dentist said the denture and/or implants would have failed because my arch has completely fell to almost a straight line and my jaw/bite collapsed too. She fit me for an occlusal Guard to put my jaw where it used to be.
I really wanted implants so I went to a dentist my ex told me about. He said I have a "very unique situation, since I have RA (infusions of Oriencia), periodontal disease, Osteop., hypothyroid, and severe back issues. He sent me to surgeon 3 who said I have more than enough bone and could do a bridge with 4 implants, pull my molars below and put two implants there for $15,000 and the dentist who referred me would take over until everything heals and then put in a permanent bridge for $10,000 more. That's if nothing goes wrong.
I cry every day because I don't know what to do. I'm scared my back is going to collapse before they can do something with my teeth. I have all my bottom teeth but two in the back but I have grinded them down from stress. I am retired and this is scaring me.

Kudos for a really good and thoughtful explanation of the situation and possible pathways forward. Kudos to the great moderators here in general.

To answer your questions since you make sense. I have severe periodontal disease. I could not afford treatment, but now I can. The middle two bottom teeth look like they are disintegrating. I guess that is where I need crowns, but most people I have seen said I could keep my bottom teeth except the molars.
I have the front four teeth left on top, one 1/4 of what it was. I want the All on 4 with a bridge. All but one dentist said no, I need a denture with implants supporting it.
The one surgeon offering me All on 4, with a bridge, works with the dentist who sent me to him.