Neuropathy: Numbness only, no pain

Posted by John, Volunteer Mentor @johnbishop, Sep 10, 2020

When I was first diagnosed with idiopathic small fiber peripheral neuropathy and numbness was my only symptom, my neurologist told me that I am one of the "lucky" few who didn't also have pain and other associated symptoms of neuropathy. I knew there were others out there but yesterday I met my first member on Connect who has a similar diagnosis. I want to thank that member for joining Mayo Clinic Connect and sending me a private message that I would like to answer here to start this discussion.

Hello @afirefly, Welcome to Connect. You mentioned being diagnosed with large fiber demyelinating predominately sensory peripheral neuropathy at Mayo Clinic. The neurologist's recommendation was exercise and balance exercises. Your symptoms are less than one year and are primarily progressive loss of sensation in your hands and feet. You also said aside from occasional muscle cramps in your calves and dyesthesias in hands and feet, you experience little discomfort. Your greatest concern now is the degree of disability you will have as the numbness progresses.

I can tell you that we think a lot alike. When I walked out of the neurologists office with similar symptoms of just numbness in the feet and lower legs with no pain – and no recommendations for treatment, I was pretty down. I was told to let them know as the condition progressed and my biggest fear at the time was not being able to drive myself. That's when I started doing my own research and found Mayo Clinic Connect after being diagnosed with idiopathic small fiber PN.

You have some really good and thoughtful questions which I will try to answer the best I can.

Question: Although you have improved on the Protocol, did you ever have complete loss of sensation in your feet? I ask because I truly dread the possibility of total sensory loss in my feet.

Answer: I never had a complete loss of sensation in my feet. At the worst, they felt numb and sometimes tingly but not painful, just uncomfortable. They mostly always feel cold and after being diagnosed with lymphedema I have to wear compression socks which doesn't help the numbness feeling. I have noticed that it seems like I've had some feeling returning ever so often when I'm exercising on my crossfit exercise bike. I use it several times a day for 30 to 45 minutes when I can to build up leg and arm strength. I recently purchased a device called a Sand Dune Stepper to work on my balance issues. I do think it helps and I've noticed a little more feeling in the bottom of my feet – if that makes sense for numb feet. Website – https://www.sanddunestepper.com/
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Question: Assuming you have little or no sensation in your toes and the soles of your feet, are you still able to drive a car?
If yes, would you kindly tell me what maneuvers/measures you have used over the years to compensate for the absence of feeling in your feet while driving?

Answer: I am still able to drive a car. The numbness was always a concern in my mind but never kept me from feeling the pressure of placing my feet on the pedals and pushing them down or letting them up.
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Question: Assuming you have little or no sensation in your toes and the soles of your feet, how difficult is it for you to walk? Before my neuropathy, if my foot was in a position too long it would "go to sleep" from lack of circulation to the nerves. The sensation would return seconds later once I changed my foot position. However, I don't believe I would have been able to walk on that sleeping foot until the circulation had been restored. Please tell me if there are/were any maneuvers/measures you have used over the years to compensate for the absence of feeling in your feet while walking.

Answer: When I was in my late 40s, my wife would sometimes tell me that I walk like an old man and now I am one and still walking the same. I've always been slow getting up and slow to take the first steps when walking. I guess I would call it trying to be careful because I wasn't sure of my footing. I think recognizing that your feet may not be as steady is a good thing and keeps you alert when walking. I struggle with walking any distance due to lower back issues. I recently had some physical therapy to learn some back and stomach muscle strengthing exercises which has helped some. Now I just have to execute a plan to do them often.
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Question: You indicated that the cost of the old Protocol was under $10/day (prior to 525 Protocol) several years ago and that the current 525 Protocol is $6.44/day. Does that mean Protocol 525 these days costs somewhat less than the old (original) Protocol?

Answer: Each item in the original protocol lasted a different number of days so the cost was more spread out and roughly calculated at under $10/day. The new 525 Protocol is a 30 day supply for $6.44/day ($193.20). It's also fewer pills to swallow which I really like. The Ramp up version is different due to the R-ALA in the regular 30 day supply. The daily R-ALA dosage is 1200 mg which causes some people to have stomach problems so the ramp up is to gradually increase the dosage to get use to the higher amount. I never had an issue because I was already taking supplements for the PN from my research and was taking that amount of ALA before I found the original protocol. Related discussion — Have you tried the new Protocol 525 product for neuropathy relief?: https://connect.mayoclinic.org/discussion/have-you-tried-the-new-protocol-525-product-for-neuropathy-relief/
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Question: Do you use orthotics or inserts in your shoes? Special shoes?

Answer: I've tried some orthotics and different inserts but don't always use them. I found some felt/wool inserts that I like during the winter time as an extra cushion. I do like Sketchers because of the memory foam cushion and comfort. I used to wear the canvas shell ones but my neurologist told me it would be best to wear shoes with good side support for walking. So, I try to choose slip-ons with good side support made out of leather. There is another discussion on Connect you might find helpful for shoes – If the shoe fits…right?: https://connect.mayoclinic.org/discussion/if-the-shoe-fits-right/
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Question: Besides daily foot exams, lotion to your feet, and avoiding barefoot walking, are there any other measures you use to protect your numb feet?

Answer: For me, this all started with a trip to the ER after waking up one night to go to the bathroom and when reaching the bathroom seeing blood all over the floor and trying to figure out where it's coming from. Surprised was I to see it pumping in a small stream from my ankle. Long story short, I unconciously rubbed my feet during the night and I had a hang nail on my big toe which tore the skin and part of a vein close to the surface. After that episode, I always wear white short loose socks to bed and I apply lotion to my feet and legs to keep them moisturized. I think that also helps with the healing process when you think that there are tiny sensory nerves just under the skin and it helps to keep the skin moist to protect them.

Hope this helps…let me know if I missed anything or if you have any other questions. We have a great group of members with a lot of experience here on Connect.

John

Interested in more discussions like this? Go to the Neuropathy Support Group.

@lecowing

Just found this web sites. It is very difficult to get information on neuropathy without pain. I am 84 years old. I started noticing my condition when I was about 70. I would be working in the yard and look down and see blood on my legs or hand and didn't feel anything. By the time I reached 79 I Had to stop playing golf and bowling because of balance problems. Then I stopped driving because I couldn't feel the brake and gas pedals. I am still able to walk inside the house without a cane but if I need to stand still to do something (like shave or wash dishes) I have to be in contact with furniture or wall. If I go outside the house, I need to use a cane or walking stick. I know what the future holds in store for me as my father and one of my four sisters had the same problems.

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Welcome @lecowing, You are right about it being difficult to get information on neuropathy without pain. Even getting information on neuropathy itself can be difficult at times. That's also how I found Mayo Clinic Connect when I was first diagnosed with neuropathy after 20+ years of knowing I had it but going undiagnosed because my doctors had always told me there wasn't anything that would help even if it was nerve damage. I'm 78 years young myself so not too far behind you.

I'm still driving but I do have some of the same struggles you have with walking and standing but it's really more to do with my lower back than my feet. Although my feet have been numb starting with the toes for many years, this past year I've had some hope return as a little feeling seems to be coming back. I posted my neuropathy story in another discussion here - https://connect.mayoclinic.org/comment/310341/

Two websites you might find helpful in case you haven't seen them:
-- Foundation for Peripheral Neuropathy: https://www.foundationforpn.org/
-- Neuropathy Commons: https://neuropathycommons.org/

It sounds like you like to stay active. Do you have a regular daily routine for activities or exercises?

REPLY
@johnbishop

Welcome @lecowing, You are right about it being difficult to get information on neuropathy without pain. Even getting information on neuropathy itself can be difficult at times. That's also how I found Mayo Clinic Connect when I was first diagnosed with neuropathy after 20+ years of knowing I had it but going undiagnosed because my doctors had always told me there wasn't anything that would help even if it was nerve damage. I'm 78 years young myself so not too far behind you.

I'm still driving but I do have some of the same struggles you have with walking and standing but it's really more to do with my lower back than my feet. Although my feet have been numb starting with the toes for many years, this past year I've had some hope return as a little feeling seems to be coming back. I posted my neuropathy story in another discussion here - https://connect.mayoclinic.org/comment/310341/

Two websites you might find helpful in case you haven't seen them:
-- Foundation for Peripheral Neuropathy: https://www.foundationforpn.org/
-- Neuropathy Commons: https://neuropathycommons.org/

It sounds like you like to stay active. Do you have a regular daily routine for activities or exercises?

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I ride my exercise bike and walk around our yard using my walking stick. Do you or others in this group have family members with peripheral neuropathy?

REPLY
@lecowing

I ride my exercise bike and walk around our yard using my walking stick. Do you or others in this group have family members with peripheral neuropathy?

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I have a sister that has since passed away that had diabetes and neuropathy. I also have a cousin in another state that has neuropathy.

REPLY

I also have numbness only, since May of 2019.
It came on all of a sudden in the left foot, then a year later moved to the right foot.
No "smoking gun" cause as of yet.
- Blood sugar a tad high (A1C is fine but fasting glucose low 100s)
- Low B12 but have been taking B12 shots for years
- There is an issue in my lower back, but doctors looking at the MRI don't see a major issue.
It seems worse first thing in the morning. Walking makes it somewhat better, i walk a lot. Using a vibrator on my feet also makes it better, short term.
I have tried lots of things, including alpha liopic acid.
Chiropractor thinks the back is the cause, but spine experts think not.
Chiropractor referred me to spine/sports doc for cortisone shot in back. He does not think that will do anything but willing to try a straight epidural to see if that does anything as diagnostic test, so I plan to try that.
I have sleep apnea, so who knows, maybe low oxygen is a cause -- working on fixing that.
Also working on losing weight, getting there, 6-1 225 > now 205 > headed to 185.
Age 64
May 2022 will be 3 years since it started. In that time, on a 0-5 scale, numbness has gone from Left: 2 Right: 0 >> Left: 3 Right: 3
Will report back if anything works (or does not work).

REPLY
@johnbishop

I have a sister that has since passed away that had diabetes and neuropathy. I also have a cousin in another state that has neuropathy.

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How about your hands? I can no longer touch type on the computer and find it almost impossible to button a shirt.

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@lecowing

How about your hands? I can no longer touch type on the computer and find it almost impossible to button a shirt.

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I do have some stiffness in my hands and fingers but no real pain. I sometimes have a little trouble with the keyboard for my computer. I try and do hand/finger exercises several times during the day when I'm not doing anything else. I think this helps with the hand and finger mobility and strength. I'm not much for buttoning shirts anymore. I've become a member of the casual generation and no longer wear suits and ties. I love my pull overs or full zip lightweight tops.

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@lecowing

I ride my exercise bike and walk around our yard using my walking stick. Do you or others in this group have family members with peripheral neuropathy?

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My mother had peripheral neuropathy, her legs were numb up to her knees. I had a slight amount, but it got much worse after chemotherapy for breast cancer.

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@raebaby

My mother had peripheral neuropathy, her legs were numb up to her knees. I had a slight amount, but it got much worse after chemotherapy for breast cancer.

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My legs are numb up to the knees also. When I take a shower I have to aim the water above my knees to tell when the water gets warm.

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@lecowing

My legs are numb up to the knees also. When I take a shower I have to aim the water above my knees to tell when the water gets warm.

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My biggest problem now is that I can't feel the pedals on my car to drive. I'm going to try a set of portable hand controls.

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@raebaby

My biggest problem now is that I can't feel the pedals on my car to drive. I'm going to try a set of portable hand controls.

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My neighbor across the street got the hand controls and they seem to work OK. His problems are related to nerves in his back and thighs. I gave up my driver's license about four years ago and my wife does all the driving.

REPLY
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