Wow , so much knowledge here. Everyone has so much to say. Phil you too. I have calmed down. My apologies. Where I come from the capesh comment struck a nerve. In regards to ADT, testosterone etc. I had a internist years ago tell me the concern for me (based on blood tests) was that guys have 2 or 3 types of estrogens in them, and I had a ratio that was a little out of line. , forgetting details now seem to remember something about aromatase issues? I know I'm late to the party on this dynamic discussion, but any thoughts? thank you, Hans, for starting ,,thank you Jeff and Phil for your ongoing contribution to the information exchange and thank you to everyone else for their thoughtful responses.