Anyone against multiple biopsy’s for low grade prostate cancer?

Posted by batsam10 @batsam10, Sep 9, 2023

Hello all, I’m a 60 year old male with low grade prostrate cancer. My first biopsy was September of 2022. 18 cores were pulled with 3 coming back cancerous, My Gleason score was 3 + 3. My PSA has increased every year for the last 3 years but is low at 5.7. I am on active surveillance and just had my follow up this week. My PA suggested doing another biopsy. My older brother has a more serious case of prostrate cancer and said don’t let them continue to do biopsy’s with my current status. He claims the multiple biopsy’s he has done has made him incontinent and impotent. He believes doing another biopsy after having one 1-year ago is unnecessary for me. Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.

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One well-known urologist I asked about biopsies possibly spreading the cancer replied something like: If that were true, others smarter than me (this urologist had already said that was not possible/highly unlikely -- I forget which) would have discovered it (and reported it in the literature).

I (not a medical professional), personally, remain skeptical.

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My second biopsy(6 years apart) showed Gleason at 3+4. I decided on RP one year ago November. My pathology report showed Gleason was actually 4+5. So far my PSA has been < 0.01 on four PSA blood draws in the last year. My point is my biopsy score wasn’t accurate. Best of luck in whatever you choose.

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My 1st Biopsy was negative . My Urologist said " Good news -- You do not have canccer " . This was in conflict with my MRI PI RAD 5 Score . I , not my Urologist , requested a 2nd Transperineal MRI Fusion Biopsy , the same as the first , except . The 1st was 5 cores in the target zone , the 2nd 16 core with 6 cores in the same target zone .
Plus I had a 2nd MRI with contrast for my 2nd biopsy ( Both MRI , at different clinics , were iidentical , both RADS 5 .
My 2nd Biopsy results . All 6 cores in the target area Gleason 3 + 3 = 6 A 2nd Opinion of these results came back
Gleason 3 + 4 = 7 for all 6 cores . A 3rd opinion was 4 cores Gleason 6 , 2 cores Gleason 3 + 4 = 7 .
Take your pick . AS NOTED IN DR. PATRICK WALSH'S BOOK 5th EDITION : Everyone should get a 2nd or 3rd opinion of their Biopsy pathology results . Finally : 'NO -- A BIOPSY DOES NOT SPREAD THE CANCER . THIS HAS BEEN PROVEN , WORLDWIDE .

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Alls I can say I’ve been cancer free for 13 years now, I had several biopsies and one almost killed me. I sometimes wonder if it’s all worth it. The anxiety of having a limp penis when you want sex has been an uphill struggle, costly also I will admit at 77 I’ve finally found the right combination. Good luck

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@brewst

Remember -- the biopsy needle pulls out a bit of tissue for examination. Can it release some malignant cells into the bloodstream as it's withdrawn ?? Don't mess with unnecessary disturbances to a tumor.

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“Unnecessary disturbances to a TUMOR”? If you have a tumor, as indicated by an MRI, I don’t think there is anything unnecessary about knowing how aggressive it is, do you?

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@fcstar98

Biopsy doesn't spread cancer, great question. How about multiple Biopsy now exposing cells to oxygen, does oxygen make cells grow ?

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The cells are already exposed to oxygen via your own red blood cells coming into contact with them.
They do not exist in a vacuum, but rather they are mixed into the stroma of the gland. It’s only when a large number of them grow together in a mass that it becomes a distinct tumor.
A lot of the ‘focal’ therapies, by necessity, have to ablate or destroy healthy cells at the margins (like radiation) and cannot simply destroy the tumor only.

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THAT was a very interesting article - good find! There are a lot things to consider. Firstly, the time period of 2002-2009 tells me that all these biopsies were trans-rectal -NOT, in my opinion, the safest, most direct route to the gland. I am certain that much trauma is caused by this route and tissue tearing and disruption may indeed cause cancerous cells to come loose and possibly “seed” the area.
Also, it states that immediately after the biopsy PCa cells were observed in the bone marrow; but the authors do not say if they were there BEFORE the biopsy. It may seem that we are to assume that they did look for them, but the fact that it is not clearly stated makes me wonder….
I, like many men, was terrified of the biopsy for all of these unanswered questions and only after I found a urologist who performed trans-perineal biopsies did I consent to undergo one.
I was found to have extensive Gleason 4+3 with perineural invasion. Surgical pathology showed a tiny break in the capsule but margins were clear.
So if I did not have the biopsy 5 years ago I would probably be Stage 4 by now or dead. So many men on this board were found to be Stage 4 ALREADY at the time of their FIRST biopsy!! So what caused that??
I truly think it’s the same in medicine as it is in investing: What’s the risk/reward? IF biopsies COULD cause seeding of a low grade cancer, what’s the real harm; as opposed to finding a high grade cancer which can be treated before it spreads further? Sure, if it can seed a low grade one it can seed a high grade one as well - but that high grade one IS gonna seed itself no matter what and maybe with future treatment ( surgery, radiation, hormones, etc) you can prevent that Stage 4 scenario from ever happening. Does it suck? You betcha!
The authors state that it would be great in the future if PCa could be diagnosed solely with scans, blood tests and AI…YES, IT WOULD!! But unfortunately we are not there yet and you still have to roll those dice when your very life is at stake for deciding to do a biopsy or not.

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I agreed if it wasn’t for another biopsy I probably be dead today I was on active surveillance for 7 years until my Gleason score went from 6 to 7 stage 2 . I went with robotic surgery almost a year later my PSA still undetectable..

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