Symptoms of osteoporosis

Posted by snowmass @snowmass, Oct 7 9:47am

Hello
Just wondered what symptoms were experienced before bone density test in general for osteoporosis and if anyone had joint pain in all joints that came suddenly ?
Thank you

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Yes I will share the lab tests once I have a moment to sit down and organize them in writing and purpose.
Also, just listened to “what do you do after an osteoporosis diagnosis with Margie Bissinger podcast - highly recommend. She mentioned 4 important lab tests to get. Check it out.

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@shexy

Yes I will share the lab tests once I have a moment to sit down and organize them in writing and purpose.
Also, just listened to “what do you do after an osteoporosis diagnosis with Margie Bissinger podcast - highly recommend. She mentioned 4 important lab tests to get. Check it out.

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I dug out one of McCormick's early e-mails to me. Here is the list of labs he requested:

24-hour urine calcium
CTX
P1NP
Homocysteine
hsCRP
Vitamin D
SPEP (serum protein electrophoresis)
Phosphorus
(the following are included in a Celiac Antibodies Profile at Labcorp):
- Anti-tissue transglutaminase lgA
- Total lgA
- Anti-gliadin antibodies lgA & lgG

I'm a male, so there may be additional tests specific for females.

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@shexy

Yes I will share the lab tests once I have a moment to sit down and organize them in writing and purpose.
Also, just listened to “what do you do after an osteoporosis diagnosis with Margie Bissinger podcast - highly recommend. She mentioned 4 important lab tests to get. Check it out.

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@shexy Would you have the link to Margie Bissinger's podcast or name with the 4 important lab tests? Thanks for sharing your information.

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@njx58

I dug out one of McCormick's early e-mails to me. Here is the list of labs he requested:

24-hour urine calcium
CTX
P1NP
Homocysteine
hsCRP
Vitamin D
SPEP (serum protein electrophoresis)
Phosphorus
(the following are included in a Celiac Antibodies Profile at Labcorp):
- Anti-tissue transglutaminase lgA
- Total lgA
- Anti-gliadin antibodies lgA & lgG

I'm a male, so there may be additional tests specific for females.

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@nix58 Thanks for posting this list from McCormick's email!

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@njx58

I dug out one of McCormick's early e-mails to me. Here is the list of labs he requested:

24-hour urine calcium
CTX
P1NP
Homocysteine
hsCRP
Vitamin D
SPEP (serum protein electrophoresis)
Phosphorus
(the following are included in a Celiac Antibodies Profile at Labcorp):
- Anti-tissue transglutaminase lgA
- Total lgA
- Anti-gliadin antibodies lgA & lgG

I'm a male, so there may be additional tests specific for females.

Jump to this post

@shexy Here is an article on lab tests, including info on what throws bone markers off: I didn't know that fractures can raise BTM's
"Fracture leads to an increase in BTMs which is evident even 6 months after the event [22]; bone formation markers may remain raised even at 52 weeks [23], while resorption markers generally return baseline by then [24]."

My endo doesn't do bone markers, saying they don't tell the whole story and are affected by many things (for me, kidney disease). That leaves me feeling like I am flying a plane in the dark with no instrument panel (except DEXA).

My doctor does albumin, not SPEP. SPEP is to test for multiple myeloma. Other tests might include thyroid levels and test for Cushing's ( high cortisol so similar to use of steroids I guess).

Some doctors won't do homocysteine. I take folate and sometimes liposomal glutathione to keep it down w/out testing because my doctor won't order it.

I would think celiac testing would be a stretch for older patients: my kid has celiac and we sure did know there was something wrong. Maybe it is silent for some? You can be gluten sensitive without having celiac, which is an autoimmune disorder. My doctor doesn't order these but I avoid gluten and dairy anyway to reduce inflammation. McCormick aims to reduce inflammation which he writes about as a factor in bone loss.

My blood calcium has always been at the high end of normal at 10.3 but Reclast has lowered it to 9.4. I am going to ask for a urine calcium test at some point.

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@windyshores

@shexy Here is an article on lab tests, including info on what throws bone markers off: I didn't know that fractures can raise BTM's
"Fracture leads to an increase in BTMs which is evident even 6 months after the event [22]; bone formation markers may remain raised even at 52 weeks [23], while resorption markers generally return baseline by then [24]."

My endo doesn't do bone markers, saying they don't tell the whole story and are affected by many things (for me, kidney disease). That leaves me feeling like I am flying a plane in the dark with no instrument panel (except DEXA).

My doctor does albumin, not SPEP. SPEP is to test for multiple myeloma. Other tests might include thyroid levels and test for Cushing's ( high cortisol so similar to use of steroids I guess).

Some doctors won't do homocysteine. I take folate and sometimes liposomal glutathione to keep it down w/out testing because my doctor won't order it.

I would think celiac testing would be a stretch for older patients: my kid has celiac and we sure did know there was something wrong. Maybe it is silent for some? You can be gluten sensitive without having celiac, which is an autoimmune disorder. My doctor doesn't order these but I avoid gluten and dairy anyway to reduce inflammation. McCormick aims to reduce inflammation which he writes about as a factor in bone loss.

My blood calcium has always been at the high end of normal at 10.3 but Reclast has lowered it to 9.4. I am going to ask for a urine calcium test at some point.

Jump to this post

My neighbor was diagnosed with celiac when she was in her 60's. I have had the SPEP test for something other than myeloma. (My gamma globulin was flagged as being too low.) And according to the rheumatologist I saw last week, C-reactive protein is a good indicator of inflammation which I don't have so now being referred elsewhere.

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@normahorn

My neighbor was diagnosed with celiac when she was in her 60's. I have had the SPEP test for something other than myeloma. (My gamma globulin was flagged as being too low.) And according to the rheumatologist I saw last week, C-reactive protein is a good indicator of inflammation which I don't have so now being referred elsewhere.

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Yes my CRP is always high. I have lupus. SED rate is normal.

I did not write anything definitive about celiac and age. I asked if it could sometimes be silent. I do not make definitive statements about things I don't know about. Did your friend have a biopsy? My kid was so sick with celiac at age 14 that she was in hospital, so I wonder what your friend has experienced throughout life.

My doctor just tests albumin and doesn't do SPEP in reference to osteoporosis. Sorry I did not mean to imply the SPEP only diagnoses myeloma. Here is a good site to explain for anyone interested:
https://healthresearchfunding.org/spep-blood-test-results-fully-explained/
McCormick's list is very thorough but then we have to get a doctor to order them!

REPLY
@windyshores

@shexy Here is an article on lab tests, including info on what throws bone markers off: I didn't know that fractures can raise BTM's
"Fracture leads to an increase in BTMs which is evident even 6 months after the event [22]; bone formation markers may remain raised even at 52 weeks [23], while resorption markers generally return baseline by then [24]."

My endo doesn't do bone markers, saying they don't tell the whole story and are affected by many things (for me, kidney disease). That leaves me feeling like I am flying a plane in the dark with no instrument panel (except DEXA).

My doctor does albumin, not SPEP. SPEP is to test for multiple myeloma. Other tests might include thyroid levels and test for Cushing's ( high cortisol so similar to use of steroids I guess).

Some doctors won't do homocysteine. I take folate and sometimes liposomal glutathione to keep it down w/out testing because my doctor won't order it.

I would think celiac testing would be a stretch for older patients: my kid has celiac and we sure did know there was something wrong. Maybe it is silent for some? You can be gluten sensitive without having celiac, which is an autoimmune disorder. My doctor doesn't order these but I avoid gluten and dairy anyway to reduce inflammation. McCormick aims to reduce inflammation which he writes about as a factor in bone loss.

My blood calcium has always been at the high end of normal at 10.3 but Reclast has lowered it to 9.4. I am going to ask for a urine calcium test at some point.

Jump to this post

@windyshores, Any chance you could share how to find the article on what throws bone markers off. My P1NP was 310 and my CTX was 1414 six months after my foot fracture. My endo wants me to take Evista to lower CTX. Now that I see that these high numbers could just be from the fracture, I'm not sure if I should take the Evista. Thanks

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@normahorn

I believe he would have to be licensed in PA to prescribe tests.

"In Pennsylvania, only licensed healthcare practitioners are legally permitted to order laboratory tests. This includes physicians, physician assistants, nurse practitioners, and other healthcare professionals who have the authority to diagnose and treat patients.
As for DCs, their scope of practice primarily focuses on chiropractic care and manipulation of the musculoskeletal system. While they may have limited lab ordering rights related to their area of expertise, the extent of their authority to order laboratory tests may be more restricted compared to medical doctors."

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Hi njhormung, I'm in PA too and consulted with Dr. McCormick. My endocrinologist in PA ordered most of the tests that Dr. McCormick requests and my PCP ordered the rest. No problem. I think he is terrific. I continue to consult with him as needed.

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@drsuefowler

@windyshores, Any chance you could share how to find the article on what throws bone markers off. My P1NP was 310 and my CTX was 1414 six months after my foot fracture. My endo wants me to take Evista to lower CTX. Now that I see that these high numbers could just be from the fracture, I'm not sure if I should take the Evista. Thanks

Jump to this post

@drsuefowler

I can't find my original but here is a study concerning rise in bone markers after fracture
https://boneandjoint.org.uk/Article/10.1302/2046-3758.114.BJR-2021-0226.R1
here is one interesting article though it does not include the factor of fracture
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5549920/#S10
Here is an abstract concerning bone markers and fractures and time to return to baseline
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00198-019-05132-1

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