Gleason7(3+4) - treatment options recommendation

Posted by manojsmishra @manojsmishra, Aug 25 3:42pm

Got recently diagnosed with Gleason group 2, 7(3+4). Was in state of shock to know about the cancer.
I’m 56 year old and fortunately I’m with Mayo care since last decade.
Recommendation for me is to have prostatectomy as radiation therapy has long term implications. Took outside opinion also and same recommendation. But not sure how to deal post procedure with urge to urinate situation currently there.
Biggest thing is I’m hoping there is no recurrence occurring after this. Any suggestion/recommendation?

Interested in more discussions like this? Go to the Prostate Cancer Support Group.

@manojsmishra I had gleason 3+4 as well. 10.2 psa. Looked into removal and radiation. Not all radiation machines are alike in terms of radiation exposure to healthy tissue and therefore side effects. Google the Mirage study that compares built in mri radiation machines, such as the MRIdian or the Elekta, to other types of non mri radiation machines. 2 mm margins vs 3-5 mm margins DO have an impact in terms of side effects and toxicity and what you see with the MRI is what you can treat vs fused images.

I was not comfortable with the % of re-occurrence with prostate removal and potential side effects though others were. Once radiated, prostate removal later on becomes more difficult. That was a risk I was ok with.

Once I picked the radiation machine, the MRIdian, I spoke with 5 radiation oncologists from centers of excellence or those that were trained at centers of excellence and made my decision as to where I was going to be treated, which was in Florida. I completed 5 hypo-fractional treatment in February of 2023 with minimal urinary restrictions that cleared up quickly.

By the way, if you are in the New York city area, on Sunday, September 22 from 10:30am-2:00pm at the New York Academy of Medicine (1216 Fifth Avenue New York, NY 10029), there is an event featuring presenters from Weill Cornell Medicine, Columbia University Irving Medical Center, and Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center, to explore critical prostate cancer topics.

REPLY

Thank you @bens1
I’ll do due diligence

REPLY
@manojsmishra

Thank you @bens1
I’ll do due diligence

Jump to this post

Also I inquired that Mayo has proton based radiation therapy option which is by far the most advanced and there are some 30 proton based treatment centers in the country. But like you said taking radiation first and then surgery if required is difficult although not impossible

REPLY
@retireditguy

Welcome to our unlucky club of guys with PC. I'm not a medical professional, and nor do I have any special expertise, and I certainly don't know which treatment option will be best for you. That said, I'm 70 and in otherwise good health when I was diagnosed 3/30/24 with 3+4=7. My best piece of advice is to go to a recognized "cancer center of excellence", which with Mayo clinic you're already doing that. Also, I'd strongly recommend the latest edition of Dr. Patrick Walsh's Guide to Surviving Prostate Cancer Paperback – (last I looked October 3, 2023 was the latest edition). It's on Amazon and it's the best $20 I ever spent. It really helped educate me on some key points in my decision making. At this point, probably the biggest thing is educating yourself. Whatever treatment option you choose, things may not work out as you hoped. So being at peace with your decision will really be integral to your peace of mind going forward. That said, another key piece of information will be how aggressive your cancer is and how widespread in the prostate. The results of a decipher test for aggressiveness coupled with the fusion MRI biopsy results giving an indication of how dispersed your PC is should help guide you to what's most likely to be the most effective treatment. In my case, for a variety of reasons my wife and I felt NS RALP surgery was the best option for me and that's what I did in late June 2024 at Mayo Phoenix. So far the results have exceeded my expectations as the recovery has been remarkably low pain and quicker than I imagined. Also, the pathology of the prostate found both Cribiform and IDC (not good) so I was glad I went with surgery. As you research which treatment is best for you, be sure to ask your potential providers specifically about incontinence, ED, cancer reoccurrence, long term survival, and other major aspects/side effects of the major treatment options you'll be considering. When I did that I was surprised that for my specific case with
NS RALP the numbers for not having incontinence and ED were more favorable that I thought they would be. Long term survival and quality of life were also factors high on my list. Best wishes on educating yourself and figuring out which treatment option will be best for you.

Jump to this post

An excellent recommendation .
My team also looked at SBRT , NanoKnife and HDR Monotherapy ( Brachytherapy )

REPLY

Investigate : HDR Monotherapy ( Brachytherapy ) , SBRT and NanoKnife .

REPLY
@jc76

@manojsmishra
Which Mayo are you at? I got my MRI and biopsies at Mayo Jacksonville. Surgery was only propose as an option along with choosing radiation. Where you not offered both treatments?

Everyone is different and will respond different to radiation treatments. Some will have noted side affects and some very little or none. I had minor side affects that went slowly away. None of them changed my lifestyle in any way.
You mentioned surgery. The surgery is major not minor and does have a lot of side affects but again some do very well and some do not after surgery. This is normal with any surgeries.

My suggestion: Have your R/O offered the following tests? Decipher, PSMA, bone scans. They determine if your cancer is agressive (Decipher) and gives a risk level. PSMA shows if cancer has spread beyond prostrate. Bone Scans show if in bones.

If all those come back negative and low or even itermediate risks radiation is a very good option. This comes from Mayo R/O, UFHPTI R/O and my Mayo PCP. Not my personal opinon. But this was for me.

I had the same test results you had. 3+4=7 and 2. I was told surgery was option and gave me all the pros and cons. Radiation with hormone treatments pros and cons. Radiation only pros and cons. Then I had all the above test done and what the R/Os recommended was radiation NO hormome treatments.

My 3.75 at time of treatments is now .44 a year after treatments ended and I HAVE NO side affects remaining. I reached below 1 on my first 3 month after treatments that was goal of R/O. Now I have my PSA check every 3 months.

I wish you luck but really do some research get second opinions. Get the other test that will help guide you and your R/O or urologist recommend the best treatment for you.

Jump to this post

What Radiation only ? Was it Monotherapy HDR - Brachytherapy ?

REPLY

I'm a patient at Mayo (Arizona). At the time, my urologist recommended surgery with radiation treatment as a back up should the cancer return and/or the PSA rose ... which it did and I subsequently had the radiation treatment. Here's a question I would ask: If I have radiation treatment and it fails; would I still be a candidate for surgery?

REPLY

I think the radiation will correct the situation that’s what my urologist said. There is nothing to surgery for prostate since it’s not there

REPLY

On February 8th 2024 I was diagnosed with Gleason 4 + 5 equals nine and a PSA of 79. The cancer had spread through my spine my ribs and my hips.
I'm not a doctor nor do I play one on TV but here's what I did.
I got a shot of lupron and added 140 mg of Xtandi daily.

Then I worked on my attitude: victory over cancer is a decision not a happening. Got on as many prayer chains as people were willing to send me positive thoughts and prayers.

Then I looked at my diet. I immediately dropped all white sugar, white flour and processed food like bacon, sausage, lunch meat etc from my diet. I also dropped red meat mostly, one red meat a week and switched to chicken and turkey as well as green leafy vegetables and lots of broccoli. I drink coffee black, green tea, Gatorade zero, and lots of V8. And instead of bottled water I now drink alkaline spring water with a pH of 8.1 because my research indicated that prostate cancer cells hate the near acidic environment of the body.

Then I started with these supplements:
Two capsules of reishi mushrooms a day (research them)
3000 mg of turmeric garlic and ginger that's two capsules a day (you can find them combined in capsule form on Amazon)
Next was 10,000 mg of vitamin C, yes 10,000 mg.

Then, while doing that, I had five treatments of targeted radiation at the metastasized cancer cells.

I hurt a bit because any cancer that escaped the prostate caused damage to the nerves in the areas above and so I used ultra high frequency radio ablation to deaden the damaged nerve endings. My pain went from about five or six to about one or two on the scale of 1 to 10.

No surgery, no chemo.

On July 12th 2024 my PSA score was 0.0 (see image below).

My Xtandi has been dropped to 80mg daily and I see my ooncologist again in October.

My goal is to beat this thing, keep it down, and educate other people about how I handled it.

REPLY
@clandeboye1

What Radiation only ? Was it Monotherapy HDR - Brachytherapy ?

Jump to this post

@clandeboye1
I had 30 rounds of proton pencil beam radiation treatments at UFHPTI.
After my Decipher test came back low risk, my PSMA was negative, and my bone scan was negative both Mayo Clinic Jacksonville and UFHPTI recommended radiation only and no hormone treatments.

Mayo originally suggested to add hormone therapy. However again after Decipher, PSMA, bone scan it was changed to radiation only. I got my second opinion on all tests and recommendations at UFHPTI.

Hormone treatment does not kill cancer it drastically slows the growth and thus a better outcome if you have agressive prostrate cancer or has spread outside the prostrate gland. This goes both for surgery and radiation treatments. This statement comes from my R/Os not my opinion.

I went with the recommendation of both R/O. Mayo and UFHPTI who recommended same. Mayo Jacksonville does not have proton radiation so went with UFHPTI which does and has been a major institution doing proton radiation since 2006. It is quite a modern facility with 5 proton radiation gantries (which means 5 different treatment rooms). They offer a wide variety of protron radiation treatments and for many types of cancers.

FYI: Jacksonville Mayo is building a new cancer center that will have proton radiation.

REPLY
Please sign in or register to post a reply.