VP's visit

Posted by ihatediabetes @ihatediabetes, Wed, Apr 29 1:15am

I have been stressed out with all the discussion on social media about VP Mike Pence’s visit to Mayo Clinic. Everyone is talking about Mike Pence not wearing a facemask. That does bother me. But now I don’t know even know what he was in Rochester for. I thought they were going to talk about testing.

Liked by Soliloquized

@johnbishop

Just something I read with an open mind and hoping we can all take this to heart in times like this. Words matter…

As governors are trying to figure out how to ease back in to a new normal, please remember:

— Some people don’t agree with the state opening…. that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some people are still planning to stay home…. that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some are still scared of getting the virus and a second wave happening….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some are sighing with relief to go back to work knowing they may not lose their business or their homes….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some are thankful they can finally have a surgery they have put off….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some will be able to attend interviews after weeks without a job….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some will wear masks for weeks….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some people will rush out to get the hair or nails done…. that’s okay. Be kind.

The point is, everyone has different viewpoints/feelings and that’s okay. Be kind.
We each have a different story. If you need to stay home, stay home. But be kind .
If you need to go out, just respect others when in public and be kind!
Don’t judge fellow humans because you’re not in their story. We all are in different mental states than we were months ago.
So remember, be kind.

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John, I would like to like this reply of yours, and I do, but still the kindest thing to do is to wear a mask, everywhere, without fail.

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@merpreb

@sueinmn– Hi. From what I've read they do not work 100% because there are too many gaps in them. BUT they do work well enough to help protect a lot of people who are ill from passing on COVID-19. Particles of the virus are larger than the mask's mesh.

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The Mask is intended for 0.3 um Particles, the virus itself is 0.125 um, this is my point. We must not feel emboldened by the use of Respirators because they are letting some virus in. Likely it takes a specific amount of the virus to cause the infection, I cannot speak about that. But I do know respirators leak at the face to facepiece seal, even if the filter was small enough to intercept 100% of the virus, some will get in between the face and the facepiece.

Remember these rules.

If they have an exhaust valve, they will not protect others from the wearer, but will help to prevent the wearer from others. For this reason, according to OSHA, they cannot be used in Operating Rooms, Sterile Areas, or areas where there are immunocompromised patients, though during the shortage, OSHA has made specific exceptions allowing a variance from their usual Standards on various issues. Consult OSHA for more information.

If they don't have an exhaust valve, they will help protect the wearer from others and help protect others from the wearer. Patients known to be, or suspected to be positive for covid or other infectious pathogens should not be given Respirators with exhaust valves to prevent them from exposing others, because the pathogen exits via the valve unfiltered.

Both of the above help prevent the wearer from touching their nose or mouth inadvertently, which is, in itself, a vital function.

Surgical Masks are designed to protect the patient from the surgeon, not the surgeon from the patient, as far as air borne pathogens are concerned. But they do help to prevent fluids that might be sprayed from entering the mouth or nose. In addition, they help prevent the wearer from touching their nose or mouth inadvertently.

I'm dumfounded that the supply of Respirators and Filters are still not returning to normal.

Scarfs, and similar, that Pennsylvania is asking people to wear might have the effect of reducing cough or sneeze products that may occur, but with Negative Pressure Air Purifying Respirators not completely removing the pathogens, the performance of these makeshift coverings should be suspect and not lead people into taking greater risks.

In my humble opinion, areas that are not saturated with infectious agents, Respirators certainly will be able to reduce what is there, and therefore worthy of the use. They will, of course, reduce it in areas saturated with infectious agents, but is it effective enough, I am not qualified to say.

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Mayo Clinic management is the culpable party. Their clinic, their hospital, their employees and their patients. Those who assert themselves to be management should be terminated. They had control. They had responsibilities. They failed.

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@elwooodsdad

Mayo Clinic management is the culpable party. Their clinic, their hospital, their employees and their patients. Those who assert themselves to be management should be terminated. They had control. They had responsibilities. They failed.

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The eyes are a point of Entry for Infection. Several had no glasses on, none had monogoggles, none had a visor on. It would seem at least where the photo was taken, the presence of infectious pathogens weren't abundant. They were wearing surgical masks, not respirators, they protect others from the wearer, they don't protect the wearers from others.
https://media11.s-nbcnews.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Video/202004/pence_mask_off_thumb.focal-760×428.jpg
Look at this photo. I see one improperly worn Filtering Facepiece Respirator, the gentleman in the back is only using one of two headstraps, and he's wearing the upper one low on his head, the lower one is dangling in front of the mask. 3 men are wearing Surgical Masks that don't protect you from others, and they don't have glasses to protect their eyes from exposure. Wearing the wrong respirator, or wearing the right respirator wrong may not be much better than not wearing it at all. I agree, Pence should have worn one, but I see other serious problems that no one has enough knowledge to address, and therefore many think the mask is the only important thing.

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My immediate reaction seeing Pence without mask was disrespect, followed by ignorance. To test yourself daily does not mean you are “clean”. Furthermore, it is a waste of tests that can be used elsewhere. Our President does not wear mask either. Reminds me of British PM who wanted to visit Covid victims without PPE and shake their hands. It did not work out well for him. I don’t think people in power should display opposition to current regulations.

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@soliloquized

I discovered something by 3M that is analogous to a problem with Chemical Cartridges and Organic Vapors. I was quite surprised. Organic Vapors are captured by Adsorption, not Absorption. As the Cartridge sits idle, the chemicals evaporate and can subsequently be breathed in, so a Change-out Schedule needs to be adopted that ensure that the Cartridges are changed often enough to avoid that situation. So too claims 3M that particles, and I believe they addressed pathogens, that are stopped by the mask can become liberated and at some point breathed in.

In part, due to clustering of viral particles, they are stopped by the respirators in a direct fashion, but to the stated efficiency of the mask, 95, 99, or 99.97%, meaning that some still get through. In addition, the virus is smaller, so aspects of the virus smaller than the rated ability of the respirator will be able to pass through easier, but they claim that due to alterations in air flow as it passes through fibers, some particles are entangled in the threads of material used in the construction of the Filtering Facepiece Respirator. I can fully agree with that.

But 3M Stresses that due to some particles getting through, and some particles entering via the face to facepiece seal that inevitably happens, that Negative Pressure Air Purifying Respirators must not be used against dangerous pathogens. They did not provide examples of which pathogens they are addressing.

I was surprised to see that Fit Tests are required for Filtering Facepiece Respirators, but the process is destructive, as a hole need to be poked into it to insert the tube for a quantitative test. See the following, I am not advocating the company, but the test requirements, if I read the OSHA Statement correctly, were suspended, due to the shortage of Respirator Products. I would think that due to the nature of the infection, they need to be done more often, not less. But if you're fitted for a specific make, model, and size, respirator, you must continue to wear that, I wouldn't think there is a universal size that you can use without retesting.

See:
Respirator Fit Testing / Mask Fit Testing∣ Intrinsic Analytics

Powered Air Purifying Respirators with Full Facepieces or Visor Assemblies. Search on YouTube for "Covid PAPR" without the quotation marks, they show hospital visors and PAPRs and Donning and Doffing.

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Thank you Soliloquized for your post, I just wanted to express my opinion, that although 95% to 99.7% is not 100%, but even if someone sneezes in ones face directly, and in the unlikely case that maybe 0.3% to 5% of the particles manage to get through, it's well known by now, that the amount of these particles, are very relevant to the degree of infection, that's why I think that those masks are the safest you can get, specially those over 99%, and if the manufacture does not call it 100%, has more to do with liabilities, because no manufacturer is ready to guaranty an absolute total safety.

Liked by Soliloquized

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@johnbishop

@lilypaws – That is great news. I'm sure that there are a lot of us including every hospital and clinic that are anxiously waiting for elective surgery and appointments to reopen.

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Thank you John. It has really been hard, especially when I'm in a lot of pain. I try to sit and do puzzles on the computer, but can only sit a little while and my low back will hurt, but doing the puzzles keep me off my pain.

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@johnbishop

Just something I read with an open mind and hoping we can all take this to heart in times like this. Words matter…

As governors are trying to figure out how to ease back in to a new normal, please remember:

— Some people don’t agree with the state opening…. that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some people are still planning to stay home…. that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some are still scared of getting the virus and a second wave happening….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some are sighing with relief to go back to work knowing they may not lose their business or their homes….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some are thankful they can finally have a surgery they have put off….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some will be able to attend interviews after weeks without a job….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some will wear masks for weeks….that’s okay. Be kind.
— Some people will rush out to get the hair or nails done…. that’s okay. Be kind.

The point is, everyone has different viewpoints/feelings and that’s okay. Be kind.
We each have a different story. If you need to stay home, stay home. But be kind .
If you need to go out, just respect others when in public and be kind!
Don’t judge fellow humans because you’re not in their story. We all are in different mental states than we were months ago.
So remember, be kind.

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John I just wish Pence would have “been kind” and thought of the people around him instead of just himself. By wearing a mask he would protect them.

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@fair2all

Thank you Soliloquized for your post, I just wanted to express my opinion, that although 95% to 99.7% is not 100%, but even if someone sneezes in ones face directly, and in the unlikely case that maybe 0.3% to 5% of the particles manage to get through, it's well known by now, that the amount of these particles, are very relevant to the degree of infection, that's why I think that those masks are the safest you can get, specially those over 99%, and if the manufacture does not call it 100%, has more to do with liabilities, because no manufacturer is ready to guaranty an absolute total safety.

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I agree. I am not qualified to say how much virus can cause an infection, but I am qualified to say that many people in masks or Filtering Facepiece Respirators in an atmosphere with an abundance of infectious pathogens are invariably breathing in some of them. I fully agree, I believe that it takes a certain amount of viral loading, if that is the term, to successfully cause an infection, and Face Masks and Filtering FacePiece Respirators are an Important Part of reducing exposure. Thanks for the thoughtful reply, and again, I agree with you.

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@soliloquized

What bothers me more is people insisting that these respirators actually work. I taught respirators for nearly 8 years in industry. Air Purifying Respirators are designed to be used in applications where face to facepiece leakage will not cause harm to the wearer, and they filter particles 0.3 um and larger to the percentage stated on the respirator, i.e. 95, 99, or 99.97% of particles 0.3 um and larger.

Covid is 0.125 um or smaller. 3M advises that Negative Pressure Air Purifying Respirators do not be used around dangerous pathogens. I wore respirators daily for over 20 years, we had Fit Tests yearly, a Quantitative Fit Test, that measures the amount of particles that get into the mask past the filters, usually by face to facepiece leakage. We wore Elastomeric respirators that fit better than Filtering Facepiece Respirators, yet they still leaked. So, anyone wearing them in the presence of an infectious atmosphere is still being exposed.

Your eyes are a point of exposure as the fluid, the tear, drains into the sinuses. People that are dressed to avoid exposure wear Powered Air Purifying Respirators that pressurize the Full Facepiece Respirator they are wearing, or otherwise provides a constant out flow of Air for special visors. In both cases, the eyes are protected. Medical personnel in Filtering Facepiece Respirators are wearing Monogoggles and visors to protect the eyes.

Face Masks, or Surgical Masks, do not protect the wearer from others, but helps protects others from the pathogens the wearer might be expressing.

Filtering Facepiece Respirators are supposed to protect the wearer, and viruses cluster, and are often stopped. Also the slalom pathway viruses take to get between the fibers helps catch small particles. Negative Pressure Air Purifying Respirators reduce, but do not eliminate, exposure to viruses.

Both surgical masks, and Filtering Facepiece Respirators, help prevent the wearer from inadvertently touching his or her mouth or nose. Surgical Masks help catch cough and sneeze products but not all. Similarly a scarf helps prevent cough or sneeze products from becoming air borne, and keeps the wearer from touching the mouth or nose.

I'm not sure why he didn't wear a respirator, but trust me, if you're wearing one and are in an infectious atmosphere, you are being exposed but at a greatly reduced amount than would occur if you were not wearing it. He might have been tested for Antibodies and found to have previously been exposed. Some people show little, to no, symptoms once infected.

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Hi Soliloquized….just to clarify…we r talking about the N95 masks…that have a 0.2 micron filters, for us as well to keep out the MAC….i have always been told by the experts that this mask is what we use both by Mayo, National Jewish, Dr Falkingham, and the list goes on…thank you for the info, but it seems conflicting, and might create heightened anxiety for us that MAC etc…have I got it right?🇨🇦

Liked by Soliloquized

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@megan123

Hi Soliloquized….just to clarify…we r talking about the N95 masks…that have a 0.2 micron filters, for us as well to keep out the MAC….i have always been told by the experts that this mask is what we use both by Mayo, National Jewish, Dr Falkingham, and the list goes on…thank you for the info, but it seems conflicting, and might create heightened anxiety for us that MAC etc…have I got it right?🇨🇦

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I believe the size is 0.3 Microns at the stated efficiency, I'll provide 2 links. OSHA has permitted non-hospital grade Filtering Facepiece Respirators, and Expired Respirators, to be used in hospitals, consult OSHA for details. But this first link says hospital respirators need to be more resistant to fluids sprayed on it than non-hospital grades. I saw nothing about a smaller particle filter size.
https://www.pogo.org/investigation/2020/03/mask-confusion-looming-shortages-n95-masks/
3M stated viral clustering generally allows larger openings to catch viruses, and rapid reversals of smaller particles as they try to course through the respirator around the fabric strands tends to cause them to impact and stick to the threads. Nevertheless they stress that leakage of the face to facepiece seal remains a possible way for the viruses to enter even if the respirator was fully capable of filtering small particles. I hope these things are thought out and in the near future products are reconfigured for such pathogens.

I support the use of surgical masks, scarfs, etc., as advised for people at home, in the store, etc., and Filtering Facepiece Respirators if they are available, but they're not perfect, I just wanted people to understand that in given infectious circumstances, even with the respirator, they likely will be exposed to some viral particles. Perhaps someone can allay fears people might have of breathing in a single viral particle. Hope these links are of interest to you, and please link me sites that may edify me.
https://www.fda.gov/medical-devices/personal-protective-equipment-infection-control/n95-respirators-and-surgical-masks-face-masks#s4

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